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Posted By: spurs

Sikh soldier makes history as he guards Buckingham Palace wearing turban instead of traditional bearskin Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2246410/Sikh-soldier-makes-history-guards-Buckingham-Palace-wearing-turban-instead-traditional-bearskin.html#ixzz2EoiTC6vD Personaly I dont have a problem with it, but couldnt he wear the Bearskin over his turban!!



Posted By: Bigade

good on him, at least he has some pride, which is more than be said for many others.

Posted By: spurs

  • Bigade wrote:
    good on him, at least he has some pride, which is more than be said for many others.
Agree 100%

Posted By: Mr Tibbs

  • Bigade wrote:
    good on him, at least he has some pride, which is more than be said for many others.

I don't think lack of pride is a problem amongst Sikhs. :wink:
This story was an aside to some of the last census results, which were released yesterday. They make pretty alarming reading I think. However, that doesn't really belong in this thread.
Good luck to him.

Posted By: bromerzz

I do not approve.

Posted By: Byker

While I greatly admire both the Sikh religion and their service to Britain, the purpose of a uniform is to promote unity, by allowing this man both a beard and turban the Army is failing in it's duty to itself and traditions, it would be far better to create and have a Sikh battalion, similar to the Gurkas, and have them guard the palace in rotation.

Posted By: geof j

Mr.Tibbs, i think you will find that this story was not an "aside" but was run over two weeks ago as news leaked that a Sikh was to guard without wearing a bearskin. his duties shown today merely coincided with the census news. But i, for one, still cannot understand why he could not put the bearskin on top of his turban.!

Posted By: spanner

I am not happy with this story, it makes me Sikh!





Posted By: spurs

I understand what some are saying about the Bearskin, but if you look at that Sikh ...with his chest pumped out, and proud, just think of what a positive image that gives out not only to the Sikh youths, but to other minorities, who might think that the Guards are some sort of private club.

Posted By: scottie

This does nothing toward the aim of integration. There has to be give and take on both sides for it to work. If the job entails a certain style of dress and one is keen to do said job then the uniform is part of it. The bearskin is traditional and expected when on guard duty and a way for this young man being able to wear it should have been found. How on earth can you strive to make all men equal when you bend the rules only one way and make some "different". It defeats the whole object and in my view is a retrograde step.

Posted By: Woodrow Why?at

  • geof j wrote:
    Mr.Tibbs, i think you will find that this story was not an "aside" but was run over two weeks ago as news leaked that a Sikh was to guard without wearing a bearskin. his duties shown today merely coincided with the census news.
    But i, for one, still cannot understand why he could not put the bearskin on top of his turban.!

:lol: Geof, that reminds me of the 'Fools and horses' episode where Del Boy tried to encourage Sikhs to wear a crash helmet under their turban!! :lol:

Posted By: Bigade

Have any of you actually ever tried a bearskin on ....... there is hardly room for your head, let alone a turban wrapped it. It is a good fit.

Posted By: TITCH

The reason for the uniform is that every one dresses the same. Phil.

Posted By: spanner

The next think you know and there will be a female Muslim wearing a Hijab standing outside Buck House.

Posted By: LynSab

He never refused to wear the bearskin ( which I find ridiculous) he was given the opportunity to wear his turban because of his beliefs, why would he refuse? Sikhs fought bravely in WW1 and WW2 no one cared about their turbans then. This soldier has chosen to defend our country and our Queen, I think we should put predudice behind us (mostly as middle England)and realise that bravery is more important. I would also ignore the DM saying insiders from the regiment have questioned it, unless they name names I don't believe it. Young soldiers nowadays go thru British schools with multi religions and multi ethnicity they are used to lots of different nationalities. It's the older generation who can't accept any change. The UK has its fair share of racism, hatred and intolerance which is ugly and ignorant, but on the much bigger plus side we are extremely tolerant don't discriminate against ethnic groups applying for jobs etc and accept that populations have to diversify in order to grow. Racism in a country that treats another nationality as below them, can never move on. There are examples out there. As you can guess I think this guy looks great, good on him.



Posted By: spurs

  • LynSab wrote:
    He never refused to wear the bearskin ( which I find ridiculous) he was given the opportunity to wear his turban because of his beliefs, why would he refuse? Sikhs fought bravely in WW1 and WW2 no one cared about their turbans then.
    This soldier has chosen to defend our country and our Queen , I think we should put predudice behind us (mostly as middle England)and realise that bravery is more important. I would also ignore the DM saying insiders from the regiment have questioned it, unless they name names I don't believe it. Young soldiers nowadays go thru British schools with multi religions and multi ethnicity they are used to lots of different nationalities. It's the older generation who can't accept any change.
    The UK has its fair share of racism, hatred and intolerance which is ugly and ignorant, but on the much bigger plus side we are extremely tolerant don't discriminate against ethnic groups applying for jobs etc and accept that populations have to diversify in order to grow. Racism in a country that treats another nationality as below them, can never move on. There are examples out there.
    As you can guess I think this guy looks great, good on him.
Agree 100% Lyn, the only thing, I would pick you up on is ...He has chosen to defend his country......

Posted By: LynSab

  • spurs wrote:
    • LynSab wrote:
      He never refused to wear the bearskin ( which I find ridiculous) he was given the opportunity to wear his turban because of his beliefs, why would he refuse? Sikhs fought bravely in WW1 and WW2 no one cared about their turbans then.
      This soldier has chosen to defend our country and our Queen , I think we should put predudice behind us (mostly as middle England)and realise that bravery is more important. I would also ignore the DM saying insiders from the regiment have questioned it, unless they name names I don't believe it. Young soldiers nowadays go thru British schools with multi religions and multi ethnicity they are used to lots of different nationalities. It's the older generation who can't accept any change.
      The UK has its fair share of racism, hatred and intolerance which is ugly and ignorant, but on the much bigger plus side we are extremely tolerant don't discriminate against ethnic groups applying for jobs etc and accept that populations have to diversify in order to grow. Racism in a country that treats another nationality as below them, can never move on. There are examples out there.
      As you can guess I think this guy looks great, good on him.
    Agree 100% Lyn, the only thing, I would pick you up on is ...He has chosen to defend his country......

Yes spurs sorry that's absolutely right, my mistake :oops:

Posted By: 2diffs

Take a look at this clip, the Indian and Pakistani military have taken their British drill training to a different level. Try doing these moves in a Bearskin! http://youtu.be/9dAMfjJugSA

Posted By: journeyman

    Quote:
  • While I greatly admire both the Sikh religion and their service to Britain, the purpose of a uniform is to promote unity, by allowing this man both a beard and turban the Army is failing in it's duty to itself and traditions, it would be far better to create and have a Sikh battalion, similar to the Gurkas, and have them guard the palace in rotation.

Agree 100% Byker

Posted By: scottie

  • journeyman wrote:
      Quote:
    • While I greatly admire both the Sikh religion and their service to Britain, the purpose of a uniform is to promote unity, by allowing this man both a beard and turban the Army is failing in it's duty to itself and traditions, it would be far better to create and have a Sikh battalion, similar to the Gurkas, and have them guard the palace in rotation.

    Agree 100% Byker

IF it has to be changed at all this is by far the best idea.

Posted By: Byker

  • 2diffs wrote:
    Take a look at this clip, the Indian and Pakistani military have taken their British drill training to a different level. Try doing these moves in a Bearskin!
    http://youtu.be/9dAMfjJugSA

I was waiting for the Monty Python team to pop up in the middle of that! :lol:

Posted By: Milschoice04

  • Byker wrote:
    • 2diffs wrote:
      Take a look at this clip, the Indian and Pakistani military have taken their British drill training to a different level. Try doing these moves in a Bearskin!
      http://youtu.be/9dAMfjJugSA

    I was waiting for the Monty Python team to pop up in the middle of that! :lol:

:lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:



Posted By: spurs

About the only good thing the British Raj left India and Pakistan. :lol:

Posted By: johnrose

Nothing new about wearing a turban in the Army We had a sergeant in the REME in 1982 wearing a dark blue one

Posted By: scottie

  • johnrose wrote:
    Nothing new about wearing a turban in the Army
    We had a sergeant in the REME in 1982 wearing a dark blue one

Dont think this has as much to do with the wearing or not wearing of a turban in the army, nor has it anything to do with racism. It has to do with the spectacle of the changing of the Guard at Buckingham Palace and the image which springs to everyones mind when they hear it mentioned. It is a job which carries a uniform and uniform means just that....all the same. I may be wrong on this one but I believe the Scots Guards are doing the honours at the moment and no one is wearing a Tam 'O Shanter they are all wearing the uniform required for the job except one .

Posted By: johnrose

  • scottie wrote:
    • johnrose wrote:
      Nothing new about wearing a turban in the Army
      We had a sergeant in the REME in 1982 wearing a dark blue one

    Dont think this has as much to do with the wearing or not wearing of a turban in the army, nor has it anything to do with racism. It has to do with the spectacle of the changing of the Guard at Buckingham Palace and the image which springs to everyones mind when they hear it mentioned. It is a job which carries a uniform and uniform means just that....all the same. I may be wrong on this one but I believe the Scots Guards are doing the honours at the moment and no one is wearing a Tam 'O Shanter they are all wearing the uniform required for the job except one .

I wore a beret and he wore a turban that was the uniform required

Posted By: scottie

  • johnrose wrote:
    • scottie wrote:
      • johnrose wrote:
        Nothing new about wearing a turban in the Army
        We had a sergeant in the REME in 1982 wearing a dark blue one

      Dont think this has as much to do with the wearing or not wearing of a turban in the army, nor has it anything to do with racism. It has to do with the spectacle of the changing of the Guard at Buckingham Palace and the image which springs to everyones mind when they hear it mentioned. It is a job which carries a uniform and uniform means just that....all the same. I may be wrong on this one but I believe the Scots Guards are doing the honours at the moment and no one is wearing a Tam 'O Shanter they are all wearing the uniform required for the job except one .

    I wore a beret and he wore a turban that was the uniform required

And if you had been on changing of the guard duty you would have worn ???? That is the point if you dont want to wear the uniform required for a certain job you have to forego the honour of doing it . The changing of the guard is a tradition which requires a certain uniform. Goodness knows what will happen in the Tower of London lets do away with that tradition as well ....why not. . I am not particularly nationalistic and as a Scot I should not be concerned at all about what happens in London however I feel that one of the few things we have not been stripped of are our traditions so leave them as they are head wear included . Byker came up with a good idea that perhaps could be incorporated in some sort of rotatation but otherwise it does not work in my humble opinion :)

Posted By: badger

Due to the worlds finical situation, as well as ours we have had to put on hold our dream of living in Cyprus. I am beginning to think someone is giving us time to think it through again when i look at the time some have been forum members. Living on a beautiful island, all that sunshine, all those things to see and do, all those interesting places to go. And all you can do is argue whether TO WEAR A F***ING BEARSKIN ON THEIR HEADS OR NOT. Will the wearing of FAKE bearskin alter the way he carries out his duties?. Get off yer computers and enjoy Cyprus Love and kisses Badger

Posted By: Byker

  • badger wrote:
    Due to the worlds finical situation, as well as ours we have had to put on hold our dream of living in Cyprus. I am beginning to think someone is giving us time to think it through again when i look at the time some have been forum members. Living on a beautiful island, all that sunshine, all those things to see and do, all those interesting places to go. And all you can do is argue whether TO WEAR A F***ING BEARSKIN ON THEIR HEADS OR NOT. Will the wearing of FAKE bearskin alter the way he carries out his duties?. Get off yer computers and enjoy Cyprus
    Love and kisses
    Badger

Badger, think it through again, Cyprus isn't heaven (or hell), after all after the "fun" of moving, setting yourself up and finding your way around life settles down to a routine' different to the UK but basically a case of same s**t but better weather... :wink:



Posted By: scottie

[quote="Byke
Badger, think it through again, Cyprus isn't heaven (or hell), after all after the "fun" of moving, setting yourself up and finding your way around life settles down to a routine' different to the UK but basically a case of same s**t but better weather... :wink:
My God is that not the truth ??? :lol:

Posted By: Kwacka

To uphold traditions, shouldn't they be armed with smooth-bore rifles and carrying greanades with fuses?

Posted By: spurs

  • Kwacka wrote:
    To uphold traditions, shouldn't they be armed with smooth-bore rifles and carrying greanades with fuses?
Nice one Kwacka :lol: I was thinking the same..... should some still not be wearing Armour and carrying shields .

Posted By: scottie

  • spurs wrote:
    • Kwacka wrote:
      To uphold traditions, shouldn't they be armed with smooth-bore rifles and carrying greanades with fuses?
    Nice one Kwacka :lol: I was thinking the same..... should some still not be wearing Armour and carrying shields .

Forgot how long you guys memories were ypu want it the way you remember it and why not . Surprised at you Kwacka tradition is part of our culture there is more to it that support of a football team as with some. There you go you learn something every day. :lol: :lol: :lol:

Posted By: Larryand Sue

  • Kwacka wrote:
    To uphold traditions, shouldn't they be armed with smooth-bore rifles and carrying greanades with fuses?

Can you get smooth-bore rifles?

Posted By: Byker

If you want to be stupid about it put them in dinosaur skin jock-straps and let them carry slingshots and a few pebbles... :roll:

Posted By: bromerzz

It should be Bearskins or sod off and join another Regiment.





Posted By: Kwacka

  • Larryand Sue wrote:
    • Kwacka wrote:
      To uphold traditions, shouldn't they be armed with smooth-bore rifles and carrying greanades with fuses?

    Can you get smooth-bore rifles?

Nope, its an oxymoron.
I should have written 'smooth-bore muskets' of course.
My apologies, I'd just crawled out of the pit.


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