Cyprus Eastern Forum Archive


This is a text archive version of our main content. To view the full site with more information, features, formatting and images please click here.

>> Eastern Cyprus Forum Archive Index

View The Full Original Topic: Pound now below 1.12......


>> Have YOUR say - Post A Reply To This Topic

Posted By: DAC

  • Kwacka wrote:
    • Woodrow Why?at wrote:
      • DAC wrote:

        Given that it is the same friend who was one of Tony Blairs advisers on Europe, when Blair was PM, and who got me in to Downing Street and met both Blair and his wife, then I'd kind of put some strength behind it being true. But hey, what do I know.

      Why did you - a right wing Tory - ever want to meet a Labour Prime Minister? (Other than to be able to boast about it later! :roll: ).
      I know I would never have been interested in meeting the Mad Witch!! :evil:

    DAC, a 'right wing Tory?
    IIRC, DAC is a liberal - he told us so (although Mr T. expressed some surprise when he proclaimed this).

TBH Kwacka I'm neither as at each election I'll choose to vote for the party that I believe has the best and most credible plan. However, those that stick with one party or another simply because they're Great Granddad, Granddad and Dad did or because "our town's a Tory/Labour/Liberal" town and always has been, are the ones with the least brain capacity as they obviously can't be trusted to think for themselves.



Posted By: Woodrow Why?at

......and that's official Bank rate......probably under 1.10 tourist rate! :cry: Brexit........the gift that just keeps on giving!! :roll: :evil: Don't bother saying it, you head in the sand be-leavers, because I won't "give it a rest".....it's a disaster!! (And even barmy Boris admitted today that there is no plan in place if we leave the EU with "no deal" as opposed to his glorious leaders declaration that no deal would be better than a bad deal!! :shock: ](*,) ).

Posted By: Andrew Brooks

  • Woodrow Why?at wrote:
    ......and that's official Bank rate......probably under 1.10 tourist rate! :cry:
    Brexit........the gift that just keeps on giving!! :roll: :evil:
    Don't bother saying it, you head in the sand be-leavers, because I won't "give it a rest".....it's a disaster!!

    (And even barmy Boris admitted today that there is no plan in place if we leave the EU with "no deal" as opposed to his glorious leaders declaration that no deal would be better than a bad deal!! :shock: ](*,) ).

You tell 'em Woodie !

Posted By: DAC

Maybe those that are constantly Remoaning about the exchange rate should've locked into a higher rate before the referendum... :roll:

Posted By: mouse

  • DAC wrote:
    Maybe those that are constantly Remoaning about the exchange rate should've locked into a higher rate before the referendum... :roll:

Normally restricted to Banks and Large corporation or shifting large amounts of money to buy a property. But can also be very risky.
Not really suitable for someone receiving a pension as the Pensions dept. will not allow it.
Nor will Private pensions or Insurance companies.

Posted By: DAC

  • mouse wrote:
    • DAC wrote:
      Maybe those that are constantly Remoaning about the exchange rate should've locked into a higher rate before the referendum... :roll:

    Normally restricted to Banks and Large corporation or shifting large amounts of money to buy a property. But can also be very risky.
    Not really suitable for someone receiving a pension as the Pensions dept. will not allow it.
    Nor will Private pensions or Insurance companies.

Anyone can lock in for up to two years and all you need is the cash flow to cover the first payment.

Posted By: Woodrow Why?at

  • DAC wrote:
    Maybe those that are constantly Remoaning about the exchange rate should've locked into a higher rate before the referendum... :roll:

Yes, I did contact the Department of Pensions prior to the referendum to ask if they would give me my Pension for the next ten years in advance, but for some reason they refused!! :roll:
On the other hand, possibly people couldn't believe that the dense population of the UK would have been that gullible to believe all the lies emitting from the 'Leave' camp!! :-k
And if the vote had gone the other way the £ would now be pushing 1.50, instead of diving towards 1.10! :evil:

Posted By: DAC

  • Woodrow Why?at wrote:
    • DAC wrote:
      Maybe those that are constantly Remoaning about the exchange rate should've locked into a higher rate before the referendum... :roll:

    Yes, I did contact the Department of Pensions prior to the referendum to ask if they would give me my Pension for the next ten years in advance, but for some reason they refused!! :roll:
    On the other hand, possibly people couldn't believe that the dense population of the UK would have been that gullible to believe all the lies emitting from the 'Leave' camp!! :-k
    And if the vote had gone the other way the £ would now be pushing 1.50, instead of diving towards 1.10! :evil:

Exchange rate January 2009 under "End to Boom & Bust" Gordon Brown - €1.0407...
And who said that you needed ten years worth of pension!!! And it because of the righteous liberals with their "We know better than the great unwashed" opinions that people in the UK voted for Brexit and why in America they voted for Donald Trump.
Plus... On the other hand, I couldn't believe that the population of Expats living in a Euro Currency country UK would have been that dense that they didn't think to secure their financial stability.





Posted By: mouse

  • DAC wrote:
    • Woodrow Why?at wrote:
      • DAC wrote:
        Maybe those that are constantly Remoaning about the exchange rate should've locked into a higher rate before the referendum... :roll:

      Yes, I did contact the Department of Pensions prior to the referendum to ask if they would give me my Pension for the next ten years in advance, but for some reason they refused!! :roll:
      On the other hand, possibly people couldn't believe that the dense population of the UK would have been that gullible to believe all the lies emitting from the 'Leave' camp!! :-k
      And if the vote had gone the other way the £ would now be pushing 1.50, instead of diving towards 1.10! :evil:

      Quote:

    • Exchange rate January 2009 under "End to Boom & Bust" Gordon Brown - €1.0407...
      And who said that you needed ten years worth of pension!!! And it because of the righteous liberals with their "We know better than the great unwashed" opinions that people in the UK voted for Brexit and why in America they voted for Donald Trump.[/ quote]

    And may God have mercy on their souls.
    Not me, the other one. :wink:

Posted By: mouse

  • DAC wrote:
    • mouse wrote:
      • DAC wrote:
        Maybe those that are constantly Remoaning about the exchange rate should've locked into a higher rate before the referendum... :roll:

      Normally restricted to Banks and Large corporation or shifting large amounts of money to buy a property. But can also be very risky.
      Not really suitable for someone receiving a pension as the Pensions dept. will not allow it.
      Nor will Private pensions or Insurance companies.

    Anyone can lock in for up to two years and all you need is the cash flow to cover the first payment.

Can you write to Pension wise for me and tell them they are wrong with what they told me. Oh! and my private pension company. :roll:

Posted By: sugarray1955

  • DAC wrote:
    • mouse wrote:
      • DAC wrote:
        Maybe those that are constantly Remoaning about the exchange rate should've locked into a higher rate before the referendum... :roll:

      Normally restricted to Banks and Large corporation or shifting large amounts of money to buy a property. But can also be very risky.
      Not really suitable for someone receiving a pension as the Pensions dept. will not allow it.
      Nor will Private pensions or Insurance companies.

    Anyone can lock in for up to two years and all you need is the cash flow to cover the first payment.

Great if you have access to a crystal ball :roll: The futures market is too volatile to do what you say, you could just as easily lose money going down this route. At least it is back to 1.12330 on TW as I type.

Posted By: Kwacka

  • DAC wrote:

    Exchange rate January 2009 under "End to Boom & Bust" Gordon Brown - €1.0407...

I wonder what was happening to economies around the world in 2008/09?
:roll:

Posted By: mouse

  • Kwacka wrote:
    • DAC wrote:

      Exchange rate January 2009 under "End to Boom & Bust" Gordon Brown - €1.0407...

    I wonder what was happening to economies around the world in 2008/09?
    :roll:

I think some Tories forget that.
And are very selective with their memories.

Posted By: Woodrow Why?at

  • DAC wrote:
    • Woodrow Why?at wrote:
      • DAC wrote:
        Maybe those that are constantly Remoaning about the exchange rate should've locked into a higher rate before the referendum... :roll:

      Yes, I did contact the Department of Pensions prior to the referendum to ask if they would give me my Pension for the next ten years in advance, but for some reason they refused!! :roll:
      On the other hand, possibly people couldn't believe that the dense population of the UK would have been that gullible to believe all the lies emitting from the 'Leave' camp!! :-k
      And if the vote had gone the other way the £ would now be pushing 1.50, instead of diving towards 1.10! :evil:

    Exchange rate January 2009 under "End to Boom & Bust" Gordon Brown - €1.0407...
    And who said that you needed ten years worth of pension!!!
    And it because of the righteous liberals with their "We know better than the great unwashed" opinions that people in the UK voted for Brexit and why in America they voted for Donald Trump.
    Plus... On the other hand, I couldn't believe that the population of Expats living in a Euro Currency country UK would have been that dense that they didn't think to secure their financial stability.

What strange and disjointed remarks!! :?
But I'll respond to them, in order;
1) What has the exchange rate in January 2009, in the midst of the Worldwide financial crisis, got to do with the rate immediately pre and post Brexit?
2) "Ten years" was not meant to be taken literally, but was arbitrarily used to illustrate that State Pensions are paid on a month to month basis and one receives what the prevailing exchange rate is on the day of payment! ](*,)
3) Interesting to hear that it was "because of the righteous liberals........that people in the UK voted for Brexit" :shock: - Just knew there had to be good reason!! :lol:
4) Who said - or even implied - that Expats had failed "to secure their financial stability" :?:
Nevertheless, I would assume it obvious, to even the most dogmatic, that a reduction of some 20% in income would not exactly enhance one's lifestyle!! :roll:

Posted By: bubblechris

When the Euro eventually nosedives as it will I suppose you'll still be blaming it on Brexiteers. How's the Turkish Lira doing aginst sterling and the euro, have you not benefitted. Btw don't forget swings and roundabouts and there's no fool like an old fool.



Posted By: FSB Properties

Today at 4pm 1 GBP = 1.1255 EUR :wink:

Posted By: mouse

  • bubblechris wrote:
    When the Euro eventually nosedives as it will I suppose you'll still be blaming it on Brexiteers.
    How's the Turkish Lira doing aginst sterling and the euro, have you not benefitted.
    Btw don't forget swings and roundabouts and there's no fool like an old fool.[/ quote]
    Didn't think you were that old Chris. :wink:

Posted By: Woodrow Why?at

  • mouse wrote:
    • bubblechris wrote:
      When the Euro eventually nosedives as it will I suppose you'll still be blaming it on Brexiteers.
      How's the Turkish Lira doing aginst sterling and the euro, have you not benefitted.
      Btw don't forget swings and roundabouts and there's no fool like an old fool.[/ quote]
      Didn't think you were that old Chris. :wink:

    And, if he is that old, not so sure he should be playing on those swings (although roundabouts should be ok - he's used to going round in circles!! :lol: )
    Turkish Lira - in answer to the question - is going very favourably against the Pound, currently just above 4.60 :D but fail to see any relevance to that and Brexit? :?

Posted By: emanon

Today's question time in Westminster was hilarious -a Labour Front Bencher tearing someone on the opposite bench to shreds with sense and humour. Unfortunately the UK has become almost -seemingly- more of an international joke than Trump, the latter appears to like nepotism!

Posted By: DAC

  • mouse wrote:
    • DAC wrote:
      • mouse wrote:
        • DAC wrote:
          Maybe those that are constantly Remoaning about the exchange rate should've locked into a higher rate before the referendum... :roll:

        Normally restricted to Banks and Large corporation or shifting large amounts of money to buy a property. But can also be very risky.
        Not really suitable for someone receiving a pension as the Pensions dept. will not allow it.
        Nor will Private pensions or Insurance companies.

      Anyone can lock in for up to two years and all you need is the cash flow to cover the first payment.

    Can you write to Pension wise for me and tell them they are wrong with what they told me. Oh! and my private pension company. :roll:

Hmm, as suspected, some people seem to spend their entire lives needs their noses wiping for them. I'm assuming that your pension provider actually gives you the money, ie pays it into your bank, or do they settle all your bills for you at the end of every month!!
Step 1 - Speak to Currency house and agree the £-€ rate
Step 2 - Agree the amount you want to send to Cyprus every month, example €500
Step 3 - Set up direct debit to currency house
Step 4 - Have enough money in your bank to cover the €500
Step 5 - Receive the money in € in your Cyprus bank account
Oddly enough it has nothing to do with your pension provider, the state or the DWP

Posted By: DAC

  • Woodrow Why?at wrote:
    • DAC wrote:
      • Woodrow Why?at wrote:
        • DAC wrote:
          Maybe those that are constantly Remoaning about the exchange rate should've locked into a higher rate before the referendum... :roll:

        Yes, I did contact the Department of Pensions prior to the referendum to ask if they would give me my Pension for the next ten years in advance, but for some reason they refused!! :roll:
        On the other hand, possibly people couldn't believe that the dense population of the UK would have been that gullible to believe all the lies emitting from the 'Leave' camp!! :-k
        And if the vote had gone the other way the £ would now be pushing 1.50, instead of diving towards 1.10! :evil:

      Exchange rate January 2009 under "End to Boom & Bust" Gordon Brown - €1.0407...
      And who said that you needed ten years worth of pension!!!
      And it because of the righteous liberals with their "We know better than the great unwashed" opinions that people in the UK voted for Brexit and why in America they voted for Donald Trump.
      Plus... On the other hand, I couldn't believe that the population of Expats living in a Euro Currency country UK would have been that dense that they didn't think to secure their financial stability.

    What strange and disjointed remarks!! :?
    But I'll respond to them, in order;
    1) What has the exchange rate in January 2009, in the midst of the Worldwide financial crisis, got to do with the rate immediately pre and post Brexit?
    2) "Ten years" was not meant to be taken literally, but was arbitrarily used to illustrate that State Pensions are paid on a month to month basis and one receives what the prevailing exchange rate is on the day of payment! ](*,)
    3) Interesting to hear that it was "because of the righteous liberals........that people in the UK voted for Brexit" :shock: - Just knew there had to be good reason!! :lol:
    4) Who said - or even implied - that Expats had failed "to secure their financial stability" :?:
    Nevertheless, I would assume it obvious, to even the most dogmatic, that a reduction of some 20% in income would not exactly enhance one's lifestyle!! :roll:

1) By quoting the rate in January 2009 I was merely highlighting that the Exchange rate goes up and down, but that was obviously lost on you. No one suggested that you require ten years worth of money to set up a simple monthly regular payment plan for sending foreign currency. However, anyone that has ever done it would know that.
2) Why make such a stupid and sarcastic comment to begin with when it was clearly stated that you can secure a rate for up to two years in advance.
3) Obviously, the "righteous" comment was in retaliation to you calling everyone that voted for Brexit "Dense".
4) If someones income has dropped by 20% then maybe they should make adjustments to suit.

Posted By: bromerzz

I would think the majority of the British expat residents and tourists want the maximum buck for the pound. If you ain't getting it and you depend on the max rates then maybe time to do a supermarket special and bogoff - without passing the tills on the way.



Posted By: Woodrow Why?at

  • DAC wrote:
    • Woodrow Why?at wrote:
      • DAC wrote:
        • Woodrow Why?at wrote:
          • DAC wrote:
            Maybe those that are constantly Remoaning about the exchange rate should've locked into a higher rate before the referendum... :roll:

          Yes, I did contact the Department of Pensions prior to the referendum to ask if they would give me my Pension for the next ten years in advance, but for some reason they refused!! :roll:
          On the other hand, possibly people couldn't believe that the dense population of the UK would have been that gullible to believe all the lies emitting from the 'Leave' camp!! :-k
          And if the vote had gone the other way the £ would now be pushing 1.50, instead of diving towards 1.10! :evil:

        Exchange rate January 2009 under "End to Boom & Bust" Gordon Brown - €1.0407...
        And who said that you needed ten years worth of pension!!!
        And it because of the righteous liberals with their "We know better than the great unwashed" opinions that people in the UK voted for Brexit and why in America they voted for Donald Trump.
        Plus... On the other hand, I couldn't believe that the population of Expats living in a Euro Currency country UK would have been that dense that they didn't think to secure their financial stability.

      What strange and disjointed remarks!! :?
      But I'll respond to them, in order;
      1) What has the exchange rate in January 2009, in the midst of the Worldwide financial crisis, got to do with the rate immediately pre and post Brexit?
      2) "Ten years" was not meant to be taken literally, but was arbitrarily used to illustrate that State Pensions are paid on a month to month basis and one receives what the prevailing exchange rate is on the day of payment! ](*,)
      3) Interesting to hear that it was "because of the righteous liberals........that people in the UK voted for Brexit" :shock: - Just knew there had to be good reason!! :lol:
      4) Who said - or even implied - that Expats had failed "to secure their financial stability" :?:
      Nevertheless, I would assume it obvious, to even the most dogmatic, that a reduction of some 20% in income would not exactly enhance one's lifestyle!! :roll:

    1) By quoting the rate in January 2009 I was merely highlighting that the Exchange rate goes up and down, but that was obviously lost on you. No one suggested that you require ten years worth of money to set up a simple monthly regular payment plan for sending foreign currency. However, anyone that has ever done it would know that.
    2) Why make such a stupid and sarcastic comment to begin with when it was clearly stated that you can secure a rate for up to two years in advance.
    3) Obviously, the "righteous" comment was in retaliation to you calling everyone that voted for Brexit "Dense".
    4) If someones income has dropped by 20% then maybe they should make adjustments to suit.

Oh dear!! :roll:
1) Are you seriously suggesting that the rapid drop in the Pound since the 'out' vote is purely down to the vagaries of the market and has NOTHING to do with the UK's intention to leave the EU? :shock:
Your second sentence has nothing to do with point 1, and consequently, although not exclusively, makes no sense!
2) Not at all sarcastic or stupid but totally factual so, again, your response makes no sense!
3) I did not call anybody "dense"! I referred to the "dense population" (as in a lot of people in one place) and if you choose to infer a negative connotation from that, then that is a matter entirely for you! 8)
4) What makes you assume that such adjustments haven't already been made? :?
N.B. When is somebody who originally thought it was a good idea to leave the EU going to have the honestly, and integrity, to admit "We Woz WRONG!!" :?: :roll:

Posted By: DAC

  • Woodrow Why?at wrote:

    4) What makes you assume that such adjustments haven't already been made? :?

So why are some Eurozone Expats constantly moaning about the exchange rate then.

Posted By: DAC

  • bromerzz wrote:
    I would think the majority of the British expat residents and tourists want the maximum buck for the pound. If you ain't getting it and you depend on the max rates then maybe time to do a supermarket special and bogoff - without passing the tills on the way.

Exactly :D

Posted By: sugarray1955

  • DAC wrote:
    • mouse wrote:
      • DAC wrote:
        • mouse wrote:
          • DAC wrote:
            Maybe those that are constantly Remoaning about the exchange rate should've locked into a higher rate before the referendum... :roll:

          Normally restricted to Banks and Large corporation or shifting large amounts of money to buy a property. But can also be very risky.
          Not really suitable for someone receiving a pension as the Pensions dept. will not allow it.
          Nor will Private pensions or Insurance companies.

        Anyone can lock in for up to two years and all you need is the cash flow to cover the first payment.

      Can you write to Pension wise for me and tell them they are wrong with what they told me. Oh! and my private pension company. :roll:

    Hmm, as suspected, some people seem to spend their entire lives needs their noses wiping for them. I'm assuming that your pension provider actually gives you the money, ie pays it into your bank, or do they settle all your bills for you at the end of every month!!
    Step 1 - Speak to Currency house and agree the £-€ rate
    Step 2 - Agree the amount you want to send to Cyprus every month, example €500
    Step 3 - Set up direct debit to currency house
    Step 4 - Have enough money in your bank to cover the €500
    Step 5 - Receive the money in € in your Cyprus bank account
    Oddly enough it has nothing to do with your pension provider, the state or the DWP

So if I do as you say can you guarantee I will not lose money?? CH is an unregulated broker, there is no way I would give them a penny of my money.

Posted By: ProVox

WW:
    Quote:
  • Are you seriously suggesting that the rapid drop in the Pound since the 'out' vote is purely down to the vagaries of the market and has NOTHING to do with the UK's intention to leave the EU?


How can something that has not happened, affect the value of the currency by any means other than ‘ market speculation’ ? If you look at graphs of the pounds value over time you will note that from Friday evening until Monday morning, every weekend, the value remains static! Reason ..... speculators don’t work weekends. So it is speculators that cause currency fluctuations ............ not the events.
Speculators in the UK alone trade an amount equivalent to the gross GDP of the UK, everyday. What does that do for the economy ........... absolutely nothing, but they make millions. So if you want to whinge about the dropping purchasing power of your pension ..... blame the currency speculators ..... not the vote for a Brexit.
    Quote:
  • N.B. When is somebody who originally thought it was a good idea to leave the EU going to have the honestly, and integrity, to admit "We Woz WRONG!!"


Again, how can you be right or wrong if the event has not happened yet ......... it is no more than guess work. ( Speculation ) What you seem to disregard completely, is that speculation by economists, based on economic evidence, says the Euro is doomed any way. Even the prospect of a Federal State of Europe is a non-starter and the EU will in time revert back to the time it was a trading block called the European Economic Community. But the UK will already be on the EEC route by then, having struck mutually beneficial trade deals with all the European block members. The only way that can be prevented is by Junker and the like ....... and that sort of interference will collapse the EU as it will benefit nobody.
IMO: I believe it will turn out to be the right decision in the long run.
:wink: :roll:

Posted By: sugarray1955

  • bromerzz wrote:
    I would think the majority of the British expat residents and tourists want the maximum buck for the pound. If you ain't getting it and you depend on the max rates then maybe time to do a supermarket special and bogoff - without passing the tills on the way.

Couldn`t agree more that is why I use TW as and when it is the most beneficial for me. Exchange rates are always going to fluctuate, just unfortunate that the leave vote caused such a drastic reduction. I could speak from the pocket but what is the point? I am still a lot better off over here than if I was living in the UK.

Posted By: spanner

  • ProVox wrote:
    WW:
      Quote:
    • Are you seriously suggesting that the rapid drop in the Pound since the 'out' vote is purely down to the vagaries of the market and has NOTHING to do with the UK's intention to leave the EU?


    How can something that has not happened, affect the value of the currency by any means other than ‘ market speculation’ ? If you look at graphs of the pounds value over time you will note that from Friday evening until Monday morning, every weekend, the value remains static! Reason ..... speculators don’t work weekends. So it is speculators that cause currency fluctuations ............ not the events.
    Speculators in the UK alone trade an amount equivalent to the gross GDP of the UK, everyday. What does that do for the economy ........... absolutely nothing, but they make millions. So if you want to whinge about the dropping purchasing power of your pension ..... blame the currency speculators ..... not the vote for a Brexit.
      Quote:
    • N.B. When is somebody who originally thought it was a good idea to leave the EU going to have the honestly, and integrity, to admit "We Woz WRONG!!"


    Again, how can you be right or wrong if the event has not happened yet ......... it is no more than guess work. ( Speculation ) What you seem to disregard completely, is that speculation by economists, based on economic evidence, says the Euro is doomed any way. Even the prospect of a Federal State of Europe is a non-starter and the EU will in time revert back to the time it was a trading block called the European Economic Community. But the UK will already be on the EEC route by then, having struck mutually beneficial trade deals with all the European block members. The only way that can be prevented is by Junker and the like ....... and that sort of interference will collapse the EU as it will benefit nobody.
    IMO: I believe it will turn out to be the right decision in the long run.
    :wink: :roll:

BBB!



Posted By: FSB Properties

  • FSB Properties wrote:
    Today at 4pm
    1 GBP = 1.1255 EUR :wink:

1 GBP = 1.1319 EUR
1 EUR = 0.8835 GBP
13 July 2017 10:41

Posted By: Woodrow Why?at

  • DAC wrote:
    • Woodrow Why?at wrote:

      4) What makes you assume that such adjustments haven't already been made? :?

    So why are some Eurozone Expats constantly moaning about the exchange rate then.

Have you ever considered asking a reasonably intelligent question?!! :roll: :lol:

Posted By: Woodrow Why?at

  • ProVox wrote:
    WW:
      Quote:
    • Are you seriously suggesting that the rapid drop in the Pound since the 'out' vote is purely down to the vagaries of the market and has NOTHING to do with the UK's intention to leave the EU?


    How can something that has not happened, affect the value of the currency by any means other than ‘ market speculation’ ? If you look at graphs of the pounds value over time you will note that from Friday evening until Monday morning, every weekend, the value remains static! Reason ..... speculators don’t work weekends. So it is speculators that cause currency fluctuations ............ not the events.
    Speculators in the UK alone trade an amount equivalent to the gross GDP of the UK, everyday. What does that do for the economy ........... absolutely nothing, but they make millions. So if you want to whinge about the dropping purchasing power of your pension ..... blame the currency speculators ..... not the vote for a Brexit.

Of course the Exchange Rate is largely - possibly solely - determined by 'market speculation' :roll: but what drives that speculation if it's not what's happening in the real World?!! ](*,)

Posted By: ProVox

  • Woodrow Why?at wrote:
    • ProVox wrote:
      WW:
        Quote:
      • Are you seriously suggesting that the rapid drop in the Pound since the 'out' vote is purely down to the vagaries of the market and has NOTHING to do with the UK's intention to leave the EU?


      How can something that has not happened, affect the value of the currency by any means other than ‘ market speculation’ ? If you look at graphs of the pounds value over time you will note that from Friday evening until Monday morning, every weekend, the value remains static! Reason ..... speculators don’t work weekends. So it is speculators that cause currency fluctuations ............ not the events.
      Speculators in the UK alone trade an amount equivalent to the gross GDP of the UK, everyday. What does that do for the economy ........... absolutely nothing, but they make millions. So if you want to whinge about the dropping purchasing power of your pension ..... blame the currency speculators ..... not the vote for a Brexit.

    Of course the Exchange Rate is largely - possibly solely - determined by 'market speculation' :roll: but what drives that speculation if it's not what's happening in the real World?!! ](*,)

Well, at least we agree that the change in the rate is as a consequence of speculation! The idea of a Tobin tax was rejected by the banks because it would bring an end to speculative currency trading. Self interest prevailed?
There is very little happening in the real world and from what I have seen so far it is level pegging. Some good things, some bad things are suggested, much of it posturing ..... but as I believed from day one nothing will change very much with our our status here because it would have benefitted neither country to change it. We are just a bit less well off at the moment but that will change.
If the EU was so great we would not be leaving and I think, certainly in my case, it is the Federalisation ( German Reich ) aspect that would have pushed me toward an exit but I would actually have voted to remain for exactly the reasons you believe we should have ...... it created less problems in the short term. In other words an easy option!
BTW: I didn't vote as I didn't have a vote, I have been away for too long.

Posted By: Woodrow Why?at

  • ProVox wrote:
    • Woodrow Why?at wrote:
      • ProVox wrote:
        WW:
          Quote:
        • Are you seriously suggesting that the rapid drop in the Pound since the 'out' vote is purely down to the vagaries of the market and has NOTHING to do with the UK's intention to leave the EU?


        How can something that has not happened, affect the value of the currency by any means other than ‘ market speculation’ ? If you look at graphs of the pounds value over time you will note that from Friday evening until Monday morning, every weekend, the value remains static! Reason ..... speculators don’t work weekends. So it is speculators that cause currency fluctuations ............ not the events.
        Speculators in the UK alone trade an amount equivalent to the gross GDP of the UK, everyday. What does that do for the economy ........... absolutely nothing, but they make millions. So if you want to whinge about the dropping purchasing power of your pension ..... blame the currency speculators ..... not the vote for a Brexit.

      Of course the Exchange Rate is largely - possibly solely - determined by 'market speculation' :roll: but what drives that speculation if it's not what's happening in the real World?!! ](*,)

    Well, at least we agree that the change in the rate is as a consequence of speculation! The idea of a Tobin tax was rejected by the banks because it would bring an end to speculative currency trading. Self interest prevailed?
    There is very little happening in the real world and from what I have seen so far it is level pegging. Some good things, some bad things are suggested, much of it posturing ..... but as I believed from day one nothing will change very much with our our status here because it would have benefitted neither country to change it. We are just a bit less well off at the moment but that will change.
    If the EU was so great we would not be leaving and I think, certainly in my case, it is the Federalisation ( German Reich ) aspect that would have pushed me toward an exit but I would actually have voted to remain for exactly the reasons you believe we should have ...... it created less problems in the short term. In other words an easy option!
    BTW: I didn't vote as I didn't have a vote, I have been away for too long.

"There is very little happening in the real world"!! :shock:..... Sorry, but did you miss it? :?
The dense population (as in a lot of people in one place :wink: ) of the UK voted to leave the sanctuary and safety of the European Union to jump in to unknown and uncharted territory in the vain hope that they could stop all those nasty illegal foreigners from arriving!!
And what evidence (and - rightly - you are very big on that) do you have that us 'being less well off at the moment' is going to change?
:?

Posted By: ProVox

WW:
    Quote:
  • "There is very little happening in the real world"!! ..... Sorry, but did you miss it?
    The dense population (as in a lot of people in one place ) of the UK voted to leave the sanctuary and safety of the European Union to jump in to unknown and uncharted territory in the vain hope that they could stop all those nasty illegal foreigners from arriving!!


That HAPPENED ! It was a one off event and was democratic, whether you agreed with the outcome or not.
What is HAPPENING now is, as I said very little! Today May introduced The Repeal Bill to incorporate EU Law so that we can change it, but at least it ensures continuity ....... oh and the pound went up to Euro 1.1352 (currently) .... must be due to the Brexit?
Talking of all those ‘ foreigners ’ ...... they are having profound effects in Sweden and I believe in Germany? We at least will be able to choose who lives in the UK and who we don’t want.
    Quote:
  • And what evidence (and - rightly - you are very big on that) do you have that us 'being less well off at the moment' is going to change?

I am confident it will as we were around the current rate in 2008 and 2011 and JC will more than likely take over after the next election and, unlike May, he understands economics! The GBP averaged around Euro1.15/1.20 for the last 10 years with a couple of periods where it picked up a bit, even hit 1.50 briefly but although it has cost us personally I am confident it will rebound.
I check this out most days, timescale goes from 12h to 10 years:
http://www.xe.com/currencycharts/?from=GBP&to=EUR&view=10Y

Posted By: Woodrow Why?at

  • ProVox wrote:
    WW:
      Quote:
    • "There is very little happening in the real world"!! ..... Sorry, but did you miss it?
      The dense population (as in a lot of people in one place ) of the UK voted to leave the sanctuary and safety of the European Union to jump in to unknown and uncharted territory in the vain hope that they could stop all those nasty illegal foreigners from arriving!!


    That HAPPENED ! It was a one off event and was democratic, whether you agreed with the outcome or not.
    What is HAPPENING now is, as I said very little! Today May introduced The Repeal Bill to incorporate EU Law so that we can change it, but at least it ensures continuity ....... oh and the pound went up to Euro 1.1352 (currently) .... must be due to the Brexit?

So you think that what HAPPENED just over a year ago has no bearing on what's HAPPENING now?!! :shock: .......Unbelievable! :roll:
And the Pound 'rising' some one and a half cents, although welcome, is hardly a 'Lazarus' moment, worthy of adulation to Brexit!! :?





Posted By: Jacs

Woodrow Why?at Do you live permanently in Cyprus or do you split your time between Cyprus and UK?

Posted By: ProVox

WW:
    Quote:
  • So you think that what HAPPENED just over a year ago has no bearing on what's HAPPENING now?!! .......Unbelievable!


Quite frankly? YES! It is the excuse the speculators use to keep the rate on a see-saw and based on nothing other than computers buying and selling currency in enormous amounts on a few strokes on some speculators computer key board !

But so far ...... nothing has actually happened ! I still get my pension, no one has tried to throw me out of Cyprus or demanded I get a visa, I still have a yellow slip which says I am a PERMANENT resident and I am treated as a Cypriot, nobody has tried to stop me getting medical care on the same terms as a Cypriot or tried to treat as a immigrant ( any more than they already do ).
Nobody has withdrawn the contract for the UK to manufacture the wings for the Air Bus, or restricted the import of UK built cars and trucks, or the import of UK produced food stuff’s etc ........ nor has any country imposed any tariff’s. Likewise, the UK has not made things any different or difficult for trading or for EU citizens coming to or living in the UK. So I see nothing physical that has changed nor will it for some time yet.
So the Banks have said they will move to Frankfurt/Paris ( Hooray ) ..... but that is only the investment banks! If they have to follow the rules the EU seem to want to apply, they can’t move out until they repay all the debts of their ‘ divorce ’ to the commercial high street banks. That is going to be very interesting!
( IMO: We should help them pack their bags, as the Casino Banks are a liability not an asset .)
    Quote:
  • And the Pound 'rising' some one and a half cents, although welcome, is hardly a 'Lazarus' moment, worthy of adulation to Brexit!!

You seem to regard any drop in the rate, however insignificant, as the fault of Brexit but if it rises, that is just down to normal Market activity? When the GBP dropped 20% (?) almost overnight, when the UK left the ERM ( I was paid in Dm at the time so I remember we all got a big pay rise when it was paid into the bank in Sterling )...... that was as a direct result of that action, although speculators actions were of course behind it. Didn’t Soros make millions out of the event?
As I said previously, the GBP has fluctuated around the 1.15/1.20 mark for the last 12 months, that was initially triggered by the result of the referendum from a peak ........ but since then virtually nothing has actually changed. Go back to 2009 and you will see that apart from a couple of spikes ( which you use as the mean ) nothing much has changed since then. The average is about the same as it has been for some years.
So is it all due to the Brexit vote? No! :roll:

Posted By: DAC

  • sugarray1955 wrote:
    • DAC wrote:
      • mouse wrote:
        • DAC wrote:
          • mouse wrote:
            • DAC wrote:
              Maybe those that are constantly Remoaning about the exchange rate should've locked into a higher rate before the referendum... :roll:

            Normally restricted to Banks and Large corporation or shifting large amounts of money to buy a property. But can also be very risky.
            Not really suitable for someone receiving a pension as the Pensions dept. will not allow it.
            Nor will Private pensions or Insurance companies.

          Anyone can lock in for up to two years and all you need is the cash flow to cover the first payment.

        Can you write to Pension wise for me and tell them they are wrong with what they told me. Oh! and my private pension company. :roll:

      Hmm, as suspected, some people seem to spend their entire lives needs their noses wiping for them. I'm assuming that your pension provider actually gives you the money, ie pays it into your bank, or do they settle all your bills for you at the end of every month!!
      Step 1 - Speak to Currency house and agree the £-€ rate
      Step 2 - Agree the amount you want to send to Cyprus every month, example €500
      Step 3 - Set up direct debit to currency house
      Step 4 - Have enough money in your bank to cover the €500
      Step 5 - Receive the money in € in your Cyprus bank account
      Oddly enough it has nothing to do with your pension provider, the state or the DWP

    So if I do as you say can you guarantee I will not lose money?? CH is an unregulated broker, there is no way I would give them a penny of my money.

Are you for real????
Losing money depends upon your outlook but fixing a rate is not about making or losing money it's about security as you'll then know what will be arriving in your Euro bank account for the length of the agreement but for some, if the rate goes up then they'll be moaning that they're losing out, but then the rate could also go lower.
When we had a mortgage with the BoC we fixed our rate for two years at a time and sometimes the rate went down and sometimes it went up but we were content in knowing exactly how much we had to pay every month.
We used Moneycorp
https://www.moneycorp.com/uk/personal/regular-international-payments/#Fix%20payments/

Posted By: Woodrow Why?at

  • Jacs wrote:
    Woodrow Why?at
    Do you live permanently in Cyprus or do you split your time between Cyprus and UK?

We live permanently in Cyprus.
And the relevance of your question is.........?

Posted By: Woodrow Why?at

  • ProVox wrote:
    WW:
      Quote:
    • So you think that what HAPPENED just over a year ago has no bearing on what's HAPPENING now?!! .......Unbelievable!


    Quite frankly? YES!

Quite extraordinary!! :lol:
Let me use an analogy;
A 20 stone man goes on a diet and gets his weight down to 16 stone.
A year later he is still at 16 sone - although this may fluctuate by a couple of pounds, here or there.
Now, according to your reckoning, the fact that he is still some 4 stone lighter than he was a year before......has NOTHING to do with his original diet!! :shock:

Posted By: ProVox

  • Woodrow Why?at wrote:
    • ProVox wrote:
      WW:
        Quote:
      • So you think that what HAPPENED just over a year ago has no bearing on what's HAPPENING now?!! .......Unbelievable!


      Quite frankly? YES!

    Quite extraordinary!! :lol:
    Let me use an analogy;
    A 20 stone man goes on a diet and gets his weight down to 16 stone.
    A year later he is still at 16 sone - although this may fluctuate by a couple of pounds, here or there.
    Now, according to your reckoning, the fact that he is still some 4 stone lighter than he was a year before......has NOTHING to do with his original diet!! :shock:

Bad analogy but I see what you are trying to imply. Note what I said ...... "As I said previously, the GBP has fluctuated around the 1.15/1.20 mark for the last 12 months, that was initially triggered by the result of the referendum from a peak ........ but since then virtually nothing has actually changed." That was a one off event ..... like the fat man having lipo-suction.
Your fat man can't keep blaming his original diet or his lipo-suction if he gains or loses a few kilos.If he continues to lose weight but is still on his corrected diet ...... there has to be another reason!
It is all down to speculators ...... who I might add contribute nothing to the real economy, just like Investment Banks ...... they make money for them selves and their clients, it rarely enters into the real economy, it primarily boosts asset prices.
As for pensions ...... mine goes directly from the DWP to my Cyprus account and I never had a Cyprus mortgage, I paid cash. :wink:

Posted By: Woodrow Why?at

  • ProVox wrote:
    • Woodrow Why?at wrote:
      • ProVox wrote:
        WW:
          Quote:
        • So you think that what HAPPENED just over a year ago has no bearing on what's HAPPENING now?!! .......Unbelievable!


        Quite frankly? YES!

      Quite extraordinary!! :lol:
      Let me use an analogy;
      A 20 stone man goes on a diet and gets his weight down to 16 stone.
      A year later he is still at 16 sone - although this may fluctuate by a couple of pounds, here or there.
      Now, according to your reckoning, the fact that he is still some 4 stone lighter than he was a year before......has NOTHING to do with his original diet!! :shock:

    Bad analogy but I see what you are trying to imply. Note what I said ...... "As I said previously, the GBP has fluctuated around the 1.15/1.20 mark for the last 12 months, that was initially triggered by the result of the referendum from a peak ........ but since then virtually nothing has actually changed." That was a one off event ..... like the fat man having lipo-suction.
    Your fat man can't keep blaming his original diet or his lipo-suction if he gains or loses a few kilos.If he continues to lose weight but is still on his corrected diet ...... there has to be another reason!
    It is all down to speculators ...... who I might add contribute nothing to the real economy, just like Investment Banks ...... they make money for them selves and their clients, it rarely enters into the real economy, it primarily boosts asset prices.
    As for pensions ...... mine goes directly from the DWP to my Cyprus account and I never had a Cyprus mortgage, I paid cash. :wink:

Actually, in my view, it was a very good analogy and perhaps your poor opinion of it was partly due to your inability to provide a reasonable response thereto! :lol:
(Where did liposuction come into it......And who mentioned mortgages?!! :? )

Posted By: ProVox

  • Woodrow Why?at wrote:
    • ProVox wrote:
      • Woodrow Why?at wrote:
        • ProVox wrote:
          WW:
            Quote:
          • So you think that what HAPPENED just over a year ago has no bearing on what's HAPPENING now?!! .......Unbelievable!


          Quite frankly? YES!

        Quite extraordinary!! :lol:
        Let me use an analogy;
        A 20 stone man goes on a diet and gets his weight down to 16 stone.
        A year later he is still at 16 sone - although this may fluctuate by a couple of pounds, here or there.
        Now, according to your reckoning, the fact that he is still some 4 stone lighter than he was a year before......has NOTHING to do with his original diet!! :shock:

      Bad analogy but I see what you are trying to imply. Note what I said ...... "As I said previously, the GBP has fluctuated around the 1.15/1.20 mark for the last 12 months, that was initially triggered by the result of the referendum from a peak ........ but since then virtually nothing has actually changed." That was a one off event ..... like the fat man having lipo-suction.
      Your fat man can't keep blaming his original diet or his lipo-suction if he gains or loses a few kilos.If he continues to lose weight but is still on his corrected diet ...... there has to be another reason!
      It is all down to speculators ...... who I might add contribute nothing to the real economy, just like Investment Banks ...... they make money for them selves and their clients, it rarely enters into the real economy, it primarily boosts asset prices.
      As for pensions ...... mine goes directly from the DWP to my Cyprus account and I never had a Cyprus mortgage, I paid cash. :wink:

    Actually, in my view, it was a very good analogy and perhaps your poor opinion of it was partly due to your inability to provide a reasonable response thereto! :lol:
    (Where did liposuction come into it......And who mentioned mortgages?!! :? )

My response was more than reasonable as it showed the fragility of your analogy! Where did weight loss come into exchange rates? I just exposed the weakness of your analogy. Lipo-suction ..... another analogy maybe for the referendum ..... that one off event?
My apologies the mortgage reference was in response to something DAC posted, My error.
Be honest, you are too ready to blame Brexit for just about anything but you have nothing but speculation to support your accusation. I am more pragmatic .......and look for reasons that show you are fixated on looking for a scapegoat to blame for something that has yet to happen. :roll: :wink:

Posted By: Woodrow Why?at

](*,) ](*,) Weight loss has nothing to do with exchange rates....IT WAS AN ANALOGY!! ](*,) ](*,) As for 'nothing but speculation'....... :shock: On the 22nd June 2016 the Pound traded at over 1.305 to the Euro. On the 24th June 2016 It dropped to just over 1.23, and has been falling - with the occasional mini revival - ever since! Now what cataclysmic event occurred on the 23rd June 2016 to 'influence' that devaluation, I wonder?!! :roll: ](*,) ](*,)

Posted By: madmum

may be a question that cant be answered but is the exchange rate likely to improve, stay the same or drop even more will have to move money from uk soon & not sure if should wait or not. Nicks been stuck on 1.12 for ages. did ask & said might improve when election results fuss calms down. then possibly could drop with brexit talks

Posted By: mouse

  • ProVox wrote:
    • Woodrow Why?at wrote:
      • ProVox wrote:
        • Woodrow Why?at wrote:
          • ProVox wrote:
            WW:
              Quote:
            • So you think that what HAPPENED just over a year ago has no bearing on what's HAPPENING now?!! .......Unbelievable!


            Quite frankly? YES!

          Quite extraordinary!! :lol:
          Let me use an analogy;
          A 20 stone man goes on a diet and gets his weight down to 16 stone.
          A year later he is still at 16 sone - although this may fluctuate by a couple of pounds, here or there.
          Now, according to your reckoning, the fact that he is still some 4 stone lighter than he was a year before......has NOTHING to do with his original diet!! :shock:

        Bad analogy but I see what you are trying to imply. Note what I said ...... "As I said previously, the GBP has fluctuated around the 1.15/1.20 mark for the last 12 months, that was initially triggered by the result of the referendum from a peak ........ but since then virtually nothing has actually changed." That was a one off event ..... like the fat man having lipo-suction.
        Your fat man can't keep blaming his original diet or his lipo-suction if he gains or loses a few kilos.If he continues to lose weight but is still on his corrected diet ...... there has to be another reason!
        It is all down to speculators ...... who I might add contribute nothing to the real economy, just like Investment Banks ...... they make money for them selves and their clients, it rarely enters into the real economy, it primarily boosts asset prices.
        As for pensions ...... mine goes directly from the DWP to my Cyprus account and I never had a Cyprus mortgage, I paid cash. :wink:

      Actually, in my view, it was a very good analogy and perhaps your poor opinion of it was partly due to your inability to provide a reasonable response thereto! :lol:
      (Where did liposuction come into it......And who mentioned mortgages?!! :? )

    My response was more than reasonable as it showed the fragility of your analogy! Where did weight loss come into exchange rates? I just exposed the weakness of your analogy. Lipo-suction ..... another analogy maybe for the referendum ..... that one off event?
    My apologies the mortgage reference was in response to something DAC posted, My error.
    Be honest, you are too ready to blame Brexit for just about anything but you have nothing but speculation to support your accusation. I am more pragmatic .......and look for reasons that show you are fixated on looking for a scapegoat to blame for something that has yet to happen. :roll: :wink:

So just before the result was known and everyone thought that the UK were staying in Europe, the speculators liked that idea as the Pound rose to over 1.30 to the euro.
But they didn't like the idea when the Brexit vote was known and the Pound then crashed against all the major currencies including the euro.
Just by going by that, would you not agree that the speculators would have preferred the UK to remain.

Posted By: FSB Properties

1 GBP = 1.1420 EUR 1 EUR = 0.8757 GBP 15 July 2017 00:48

Posted By: SensibleBob

purely out of interest where are you getting those rates from Pan? Currency Fair are offering 1.1361 and are usually one of the best. Many sites quote commercial market spot rates which are never available to the public and often give a warning to this effect by saying the rate is an illustration only whatever that means. Have spent a while this week looking at the various options being offered for forward rates and there does at last seem to be an opinion that the worst could be over for the pound....until Boris, The Bank of England or that woman(prefer not to be more exact could be German or English) get involved again! Would others agree there is a certain amount of optimism that 1.20 could be a realistic target later this autumn? Certainly hope so my daughter gets married end of sept!

Posted By: sugarray1955

  • SensibleBob wrote:
    purely out of interest where are you getting those rates from Pan? Currency Fair are offering 1.1361 and are usually one of the best. Many sites quote commercial market spot rates which are never available to the public and often give a warning to this effect by saying the rate is an illustration only whatever that means.
    Have spent a while this week looking at the various options being offered for forward rates and there does at last seem to be an opinion that the worst could be over for the pound....until Boris, The Bank of England or that woman(prefer not to be more exact could be German or English) get involved again!
    Would others agree there is a certain amount of optimism that 1.20 could be a realistic target later this autumn? Certainly hope so my daughter gets married end of sept!

This the exchange rate on Transferwise at the moment, I ditched CF over 18 months ago and have used TW ever since.


Posted By: Woodrow Why?at

I think the words that ProVox - among others - are struggling to find are something along the lines of, "Woodrow, you've been right all along!" ^^ 8)

Posted By: bubblechris

  • madmum wrote:
    may be a question that cant be answered but is the exchange rate likely to improve, stay the same or drop even more
    will have to move money from uk soon & not sure if should wait or not. Nicks been stuck on 1.12 for ages. did ask & said might improve when election results fuss calms down. then possibly could drop with brexit talks

Sit on it, exchange only when you have to. With all the remoaners and experts sayng it'll be a disaster the rate will never go that high that you are losing too much.

Posted By: ProVox

  • Woodrow Why?at wrote:
    I think the words that ProVox - among others - are struggling to find are something along the lines of, "Woodrow, you've been right all along!" ^^ 8)

Not quite .......... if anything you seem to be a bit slow on the uptake! It is more a case of you don’t seem to understand that you cannot blame something that has not happened yet for the fluctuations in the GBP/Euro exchange rate.
Simple fact ..... the UK is still in the EU ..... nothing has changed.
The rate has always fluctuated but you only consider fluctuations since 22nd June 2016. You should try and look at the bigger picture.
The rate at end July 2008 was Euro 1.50 to the pound. At the end of December 2008 it had dropped to the lowest rate ever ..... Euro 1.06 to the pound. So what caused the drop, Brexit?
The referendum was not a consideration at that time. It was the 2008 financial crisis ( Note! A financial crisis NOT an Economic crisis ) it was the Banks that were in crisis not economies, and it was also Worldwide. The speculators work within the banking and financial system and it was the speculators that crashed the rates then and did so again in June 2016 ...... the blame for the drop in value of the GBP lies with Banks and currency speculators.
You don’t seem to see the whole picture or look at it against a longer time line. It really is not too difficult to work out. To blame a single referendum, for all the ills that followed, when nothing has actually changed economically, is rather naive and a rather blind approach, driven more by a fixation that all is doom and gloom, rather than a more pragmatic assessment taking many more factors into account.
Results/conclusions are always the result of the consideration of ALL factors involved but you have only one consideration ...... it was all down to the Brexit vote, everything else you just ignore.
So don’t fool yourself ..... only in your eyes are you correct ..... you have yet to provide an explanation how something that has yet to happen can have an effect on events that precede it without recognising it as......... SPECULATION. Who are the speculators? ....... the Banks and Financial system! And what do their actions contribute to the REAL economy? ...... virtually NOTHING !!!
:roll: :wink:

Posted By: mouse

  • bubblechris wrote:
    • madmum wrote:
      may be a question that cant be answered but is the exchange rate likely to improve, stay the same or drop even more
      will have to move money from uk soon & not sure if should wait or not. Nicks been stuck on 1.12 for ages. did ask & said might improve when election results fuss calms down. then possibly could drop with brexit talks

    Sit on it, exchange only when you have to. With all the remoaners and experts sayng it'll be a disaster the rate will never go that high that you are losing too much.

I didn't realise Woody had that power to affect the currency rates.
But the experts might.

Posted By: Woodrow Why?at

So PV, you continue to seriously believe( :shock: ) that the 5% fall in the Pound between the 22nd and 24th June 2016 - not to mention it's ongoing devaluation - had absolutely NOTHING to do with the event which happened on the 23rd?!! :lol: :lol: There really is no point arguing against someone so stubbornly illogical!! ](*,) :mad:

Posted By: Woodrow Why?at

  • bubblechris wrote:
    • madmum wrote:
      may be a question that cant be answered but is the exchange rate likely to improve, stay the same or drop even more
      will have to move money from uk soon & not sure if should wait or not. Nicks been stuck on 1.12 for ages. did ask & said might improve when election results fuss calms down. then possibly could drop with brexit talks

    Sit on it, exchange only when you have to. With all the remoaners and experts sayng it'll be a disaster the rate will never go that high that you are losing too much.

Can you please explain exactly what you mean, Chris?
Because what you've said sounds rather contradictory - which is so unlike you!! :lol: :wink:

Posted By: Tangutica

What the markets hate most is UNCERTAINTY. Of course it has summat to do with Brexit.

Posted By: ProVox

  • Woodrow Why?at wrote:
    So PV, you continue to seriously believe( :shock: ) that the 5% fall in the Pound between the 22nd and 24th June 2016 - not to mention it's ongoing devaluation - had absolutely NOTHING to do with the event which happened on the 23rd?!! :lol: :lol:
    There really is no point arguing against someone so stubbornly illogical!! ](*,) :mad:

I always find that those that give up do so because they have no sound counter argument.
The value dropped due to speculators. The vote result was what spooked the speculators but it was not not the cause.
The one thing I will claim to be is VERY logical. When you have explained how it is possible for something that has not yet happened, can be the cause of an event that preceded it ..... then I will take that as the penny having dropped and you accept that your losses/gains in currency values are due to speculation! No matter how you try to dress up your opinion as logical ...... it isn't.
You also don't seem to realise that your asset value ( if you own property in Cyprus or a Euro investment in stocks/bonds ) has increased. If you feel so hard done by, sell up convert all your Euro's to Pounds and you will recover your losses. Then you can go and live in the UK where your converted Euro's will buy you so much more.
The drop in your income seems to trouble you out of all proportion to the amount it has dropped............ so blame the speculators and be more positive about the future of the UK outside the Fourth Reich!

Posted By: ProVox

  • Tangutica wrote:
    What the markets hate most is UNCERTAINTY. Of course it has summat to do with Brexit.

The Markets ..... you mean the currency speculators in this instance? They thrive on uncertainty ..... if they didn't, they wouldn't make any money! :roll:

Posted By: DAC

  • SensibleBob wrote:

    Would others agree there is a certain amount of optimism that 1.20 could be a realistic target later this autumn? Certainly hope so my daughter gets married end of sept!

IMHO the rate won't climb to anywhere near €1.20 until such tines as the BOE raises the interest base rate and that that isn't going to happen anytime soon as the British public are in nearly more debt now than they were before the the recession. Raising the base rate would probably create another major slump and as such probably cause more banks to suffer like they did when Brown bought the shares in the last lot.
**** And just for Kwacka here the facts...


Posted By: mouse

  • ProVox wrote:
    • Woodrow Why?at wrote:
      OK PV, here's a simple question which just requires a 'yes' or 'no' answer;
      If the vote on the 23rd June last year had been to 'Remain' - or, indeed, if there had been no vote at all - do you think that the Pound would have still dropped 5% in value between the 22nd and 24th :?:
      YES or NO?!! 8)

    Going on historic records of the exchange rate movement going back ten years, but not on the time scale between the dates you chose .............. YES . Take any three day period, any event between Aug 2008 and Aug 2017 and the answer would be the same.
    But the vote would still be just the trigger ..... it cannot be the cause, as the event voted for has not happened yet. So, it can ONLY be down to speculators.
    Let's leave it at that shall we? I will not change my view and you will still blame the ' dense ' people who voted to leave the EU, that gave the speculators an event to use as an excuse to sell the pound and buy all other currencies but mainly the Euro.

    But, all is not lost! We now we have good old honest Tony B leaping in to save the Country and stop the Brexit happening ....... should see the Pound rocket on that news .......... what do you recon 5% ....... or more? He will obviously get 100% support from the ' remoaners '!
    :wink: :lol:

Do you agree that the Speculators and Money Markets and the Banks and Big Business would have preferred a No vote.

Posted By: Woodrow Why?at

  • ProVox wrote:
    • Woodrow Why?at wrote:
      So PV, you continue to seriously believe( :shock: ) that the 5% fall in the Pound between the 22nd and 24th June 2016 - not to mention it's ongoing devaluation - had absolutely NOTHING to do with the event which happened on the 23rd?!! :lol: :lol:
      There really is no point arguing against someone so stubbornly illogical!! ](*,) :mad:

    I always find that those that give up do so because they have no sound counter argument.
    The value dropped due to speculators. The vote result was what spooked the speculators but it was not not the cause.
    The one thing I will claim to be is VERY logical. When you have explained how it is possible for something that has not yet happened, can be the cause of an event that preceded it ..... then I will take that as the penny having dropped and you accept that your losses/gains in currency values are due to speculation! No matter how you try to dress up your opinion as logical ...... it isn't.
    You also don't seem to realise that your asset value ( if you own property in Cyprus or a Euro investment in stocks/bonds ) has increased. If you feel so hard done by, sell up convert all your Euro's to Pounds and you will recover your losses. Then you can go and live in the UK where your converted Euro's will buy you so much more.
    The drop in your income seems to trouble you out of all proportion to the amount it has dropped............ so blame the speculators and be more positive about the future of the UK outside the Fourth Reich!

So, you 'always' find that, do you? Perhaps you should get out more, because then you may discover that, on occasions, it is simply that one is tired of " ](*,)"!!
You also keep harping on about how something that hasn't yet happened cannot influence matters, but that is a very illogical stance because SOMETHING has happened.......THE 'LEAVE' VOTE HAPPENED!! :roll:
And, of course, I realise that, on paper, the Sterling value of my property has increased but as I have no intention of selling, then that is a very mute point!
As for 'being troubled out of all proportion' to the demise of the Pound, I would suggest that my, and others, response to, what is effectively, a 20% loss of income has been exceedingly proportionate!! 8)

Posted By: sugarray1955

  • Woodrow Why?at wrote:
    • ProVox wrote:
      • Woodrow Why?at wrote:
        So PV, you continue to seriously believe( :shock: ) that the 5% fall in the Pound between the 22nd and 24th June 2016 - not to mention it's ongoing devaluation - had absolutely NOTHING to do with the event which happened on the 23rd?!! :lol: :lol:
        There really is no point arguing against someone so stubbornly illogical!! ](*,) :mad:

      I always find that those that give up do so because they have no sound counter argument.
      The value dropped due to speculators. The vote result was what spooked the speculators but it was not not the cause.
      The one thing I will claim to be is VERY logical. When you have explained how it is possible for something that has not yet happened, can be the cause of an event that preceded it ..... then I will take that as the penny having dropped and you accept that your losses/gains in currency values are due to speculation! No matter how you try to dress up your opinion as logical ...... it isn't.
      You also don't seem to realise that your asset value ( if you own property in Cyprus or a Euro investment in stocks/bonds ) has increased. If you feel so hard done by, sell up convert all your Euro's to Pounds and you will recover your losses. Then you can go and live in the UK where your converted Euro's will buy you so much more.
      The drop in your income seems to trouble you out of all proportion to the amount it has dropped............ so blame the speculators and be more positive about the future of the UK outside the Fourth Reich!

    So, you 'always' find that, do you? Perhaps you should get out more, because then you may discover that, on occasions, it is simply that one is tired of " ](*,)"!!
    You also keep harping on about how something that hasn't yet happened cannot influence matters, but that is a very illogical stance because SOMETHING has happened.......THE 'LEAVE' VOTE HAPPENED!! :roll:
    And, of course, I realise that, on paper, the Sterling value of my property has increased but as I have no intention of selling, then that is a very mute point!
    As for 'being troubled out of all proportion' to the demise of the Pound, I would suggest that my, and others, response to, what is effectively, a 20% loss of income has been exceedingly proportionate!! 8)

:D :D :D I would give up if I was you, you are plainly wasting your time :D :D :D

Posted By: mouse

  • Woodrow Why?at wrote:
    • ProVox wrote:
      • Woodrow Why?at wrote:
        So PV, you continue to seriously believe( :shock: ) that the 5% fall in the Pound between the 22nd and 24th June 2016 - not to mention it's ongoing devaluation - had absolutely NOTHING to do with the event which happened on the 23rd?!! :lol: :lol:
        There really is no point arguing against someone so stubbornly illogical!! ](*,) :mad:

      I always find that those that give up do so because they have no sound counter argument.
      The value dropped due to speculators. The vote result was what spooked the speculators but it was not not the cause.
      The one thing I will claim to be is VERY logical. When you have explained how it is possible for something that has not yet happened, can be the cause of an event that preceded it ..... then I will take that as the penny having dropped and you accept that your losses/gains in currency values are due to speculation! No matter how you try to dress up your opinion as logical ...... it isn't.
      You also don't seem to realise that your asset value ( if you own property in Cyprus or a Euro investment in stocks/bonds ) has increased. If you feel so hard done by, sell up convert all your Euro's to Pounds and you will recover your losses. Then you can go and live in the UK where your converted Euro's will buy you so much more.
      The drop in your income seems to trouble you out of all proportion to the amount it has dropped............ so blame the speculators and be more positive about the future of the UK outside the Fourth Reich!

    So, you 'always' find that, do you? Perhaps you should get out more, because then you may discover that, on occasions, it is simply that one is tired of " ](*,)"!!
    You also keep harping on about how something that hasn't yet happened cannot influence matters, but that is a very illogical stance because SOMETHING has happened....... THE 'LEAVE' VOTE HAPPENED!! :roll:
    And, of course, I realise that, on paper, the Sterling value of my property has increased but as I have no intention of selling, then that is a very mute point!
    As for 'being troubled out of all proportion' to the demise of the Pound, I would suggest that my, and others, response to, what is effectively, a 20% loss of income has been exceedingly proportionate!! 8)

Further clue is that it cannot be changed.
Please stop spouting common sense woody, they ain't listening.

Posted By: sugarray1955

  • DAC wrote:
    • SensibleBob wrote:

      Would others agree there is a certain amount of optimism that 1.20 could be a realistic target later this autumn? Certainly hope so my daughter gets married end of sept!

    IMHO the rate won't climb to anywhere near €1.20 until such tines as the BOE raises the interest base rate and that that isn't going to happen anytime soon as the British public are in nearly more debt now than they were before the the recession. Raising the base rate would probably create another major slump and as such probably cause more banks to suffer like they did when Brown bought the shares in the last lot.
    **** And just for Kwacka here the facts...

You still haven`t answered my question about the possibility of losing money using CH???

Posted By: ProVox

WW
    Quote:
  • So, you 'always' find that, do you? Perhaps you should get out more, because then you may discover that, on occasions, it is simply that one is tired of " "!!

I have vast experience of banging my head against a brick wall ..... believe me ..... ask Kwacka. My answer is always the same ..... don’t tell me I am wrong show me evidence that proves it to be so! You have so far failed to justify how an event that has not happened can cause something that occurred before the event. Common sense ..... it cant, but speculation of what might happen can!
    Quote:
  • You also keep harping on about how something that hasn't yet happened cannot influence matters, but that is a very illogical stance because SOMETHING has happened.......THE 'LEAVE' VOTE HAPPENED!!

As I keep saying, a one off event! But if you look at the graph of GBP/Euro fluctuations, the pound was on the decline from something over 1.40 for weeks before the referendum. Caused by the Brexit vote? I don’t think so because the ‘ experts ’ all thought it would never happen. Using your logic if the Brexit caused the drop in the value in the GBP, then the inverse must be true. i.e. a ‘ remain ’ would have increased the value and a ‘remain’ was a foregone conclusion by the experts. So why was the rate dropping?
    Quote:
  • And, of course, I realise that, on paper, the Sterling value of my property has increased but as I have no intention of selling, then that is a very mute point!

Well ... at least we are on the same song sheet on that one!
    Quote:
  • As for 'being troubled out of all proportion' to the demise of the Pound, I would suggest that my, and others, response to, what is effectively, a 20% loss of income has been exceedingly proportionate!!

It affected me but I don’t blame those who voted to leave for that ...... I blame speculators. As speculators are the only way the value of a currency is determined.
Since Friday evening the rate has been around 1.142 and relatively steady; on a one week base line it started the week at 1.13 so why has it risen? Speculation, and for two days it has not changed because the speculators don’t work weekends. I think that would provide tangible evidence that confirms that fluctuations in currency rates are directly created by speculators ................ not events?
:roll:

Posted By: Woodrow Why?at

OK PV, here's a simple question which just requires a 'yes' or 'no' answer; If the vote on the 23rd June last year had been to 'Remain' - or, indeed, if there had been no vote at all - do you think that the Pound would have still dropped 5% in value between the 22nd and 24th :?: YES or NO?!! 8)

Posted By: ProVox

  • Woodrow Why?at wrote:
    OK PV, here's a simple question which just requires a 'yes' or 'no' answer;
    If the vote on the 23rd June last year had been to 'Remain' - or, indeed, if there had been no vote at all - do you think that the Pound would have still dropped 5% in value between the 22nd and 24th :?:
    YES or NO?!! 8)

Going on historic records of the exchange rate movement going back ten years, but not on the time scale between the dates you chose .............. YES . Take any three day period, any event between Aug 2008 and Aug 2017 and the answer would be the same.
But the vote would still be just the trigger ..... it cannot be the cause, as the event voted for has not happened yet. So, it can ONLY be down to speculators.
Let's leave it at that shall we? I will not change my view and you will still blame the ' dense ' people who voted to leave the EU, that gave the speculators an event to use as an excuse to sell the pound and buy all other currencies but mainly the Euro.

But, all is not lost! We now we have good old honest Tony B leaping in to save the Country and stop the Brexit happening ....... should see the Pound rocket on that news .......... what do you recon 5% ....... or more? He will obviously get 100% support from the ' remoaners '!
:wink: :lol:

Posted By: DAC

  • sugarray1955 wrote:
    • DAC wrote:
      • SensibleBob wrote:

        Would others agree there is a certain amount of optimism that 1.20 could be a realistic target later this autumn? Certainly hope so my daughter gets married end of sept!

      IMHO the rate won't climb to anywhere near €1.20 until such tines as the BOE raises the interest base rate and that that isn't going to happen anytime soon as the British public are in nearly more debt now than they were before the the recession. Raising the base rate would probably create another major slump and as such probably cause more banks to suffer like they did when Brown bought the shares in the last lot.
      **** And just for Kwacka here the facts...

    You still haven`t answered my question about the possibility of losing money using CH???

Yes I did as I explained that fixing a rate isn't about making or losing money it's about creating stability, ie getting the same amount of money in euros every month and not having to worry about the rate fluctuating from one month to the next.
If by losing money you mean the rate getting better after you've fixed it, i.e. you fix at €1.14 and a month later it goes up to say, €1.19 then that is a risk you have to take, but a simple way to negate this is to fix say, 50% of what you require and leave the rest to fluctuate, ie. leave it to chance. Question is, if you never fixed at €1.14 and the following month it dropped to where it was in 2009, €1.09 then you would still have lost.
Here's another example:
When we cleared our mortgage in 2009 the rate was down at €1.09 and that lower rate cost us an extra £4000. However, had we not stuck to our original plan to pay it off in 2009 and instead waited for the rate to improve, then we would have paid an extra €12,000 in mortgage interest on our payments. The £/€ exchange rate was lower but we still saved money.

Posted By: Woodrow Why?at

  • ProVox wrote:
    • Woodrow Why?at wrote:
      OK PV, here's a simple question which just requires a 'yes' or 'no' answer;
      If the vote on the 23rd June last year had been to 'Remain' - or, indeed, if there had been no vote at all - do you think that the Pound would have still dropped 5% in value between the 22nd and 24th :?:
      YES or NO?!! 8)

    Going on historic records of the exchange rate movement going back ten years, but not on the time scale between the dates you chose .............. YES .
    Let's leave it at that shall we?

:? But they were the dates I 'chose' - and, obviously for a very good reason!! :?
And I cannot believe that someone of your intellect can continue to deny the direct correlation between the vote to leave the EU and the fall of the Pound!
As for "Let's leave it at that".............sounds awfully like you're giving up :shock: :wink: :lol:

Posted By: ProVox

  • mouse wrote:
    • ProVox wrote:
      • Woodrow Why?at wrote:
        OK PV, here's a simple question which just requires a 'yes' or 'no' answer;
        If the vote on the 23rd June last year had been to 'Remain' - or, indeed, if there had been no vote at all - do you think that the Pound would have still dropped 5% in value between the 22nd and 24th :?:
        YES or NO?!! 8)

      Going on historic records of the exchange rate movement going back ten years, but not on the time scale between the dates you chose .............. YES . Take any three day period, any event between Aug 2008 and Aug 2017 and the answer would be the same.
      But the vote would still be just the trigger ..... it cannot be the cause, as the event voted for has not happened yet. So, it can ONLY be down to speculators.
      Let's leave it at that shall we? I will not change my view and you will still blame the ' dense ' people who voted to leave the EU, that gave the speculators an event to use as an excuse to sell the pound and buy all other currencies but mainly the Euro.

      But, all is not lost! We now we have good old honest Tony B leaping in to save the Country and stop the Brexit happening ....... should see the Pound rocket on that news .......... what do you recon 5% ....... or more? He will obviously get 100% support from the ' remoaners '!
      :wink: :lol:

    Do you agree that the Speculators and Money Markets and the Banks and Big Business would have preferred a No vote.

Business ...... I think they merely want to create wealth for themselves and those they employ by creating a buoyant economy, jobs and goods we can trade. Whether a Brexit suits all is a question of choice and opinion.
But the financial sector would have preferred the status quo obviously as they want to continue to make mountains of money on the backs of a very gullible population. The vote was an inconvenience but unlike Woody, they don't look to blame, they just work their way out of the problem. These people only look after themselves, where and how they do that is of no consequence to them.
Like our US cousins they believe they are an exceptional and indispensable people, but if you know how the system works you will be aware that the Banks are a service to industry that has managed to create an 'industry' out of the service, an industry which ' we ' believe we cannot do without but it is in reality a parallel economy and has very little to do with the real economy.
A complex and involved subject.

Posted By: ProVox

WW:
    Quote:
  • And I cannot believe that someone of your intellect can continue to deny the direct correlation between the vote to leave the EU and the fall of the Pound!

That is where you fail ..... who says it is a direct correlation? Only you! If you read what I post very carefully you will, I am sure, note that what I am saying is that there is an INDIRECT association and the link between a direct and indirect correlation is ....... SPECULATION.
    Quote:
  • As for "Let's leave it at that".............sounds awfully like you're giving up

No ......but unless you have something to support your hypothesis, there seems little point in continuing the discussion .......... we have said all that can be said staying within the context of the thread.

Posted By: mouse

  • ProVox wrote:
    • mouse wrote:
      • ProVox wrote:
        • Woodrow Why?at wrote:
          OK PV, here's a simple question which just requires a 'yes' or 'no' answer;
          If the vote on the 23rd June last year had been to 'Remain' - or, indeed, if there had been no vote at all - do you think that the Pound would have still dropped 5% in value between the 22nd and 24th :?:
          YES or NO?!! 8)

        Going on historic records of the exchange rate movement going back ten years, but not on the time scale between the dates you chose .............. YES . Take any three day period, any event between Aug 2008 and Aug 2017 and the answer would be the same.
        But the vote would still be just the trigger ..... it cannot be the cause, as the event voted for has not happened yet. So, it can ONLY be down to speculators.
        Let's leave it at that shall we? I will not change my view and you will still blame the ' dense ' people who voted to leave the EU, that gave the speculators an event to use as an excuse to sell the pound and buy all other currencies but mainly the Euro.

        But, all is not lost! We now we have good old honest Tony B leaping in to save the Country and stop the Brexit happening ....... should see the Pound rocket on that news .......... what do you recon 5% ....... or more? He will obviously get 100% support from the ' remoaners '!
        :wink: :lol:

      Do you agree that the Speculators and Money Markets and the Banks and Big Business would have preferred a No vote.

    Business ...... I think they merely want to create wealth for themselves and those they employ by creating a buoyant economy, jobs and goods we can trade. Whether a Brexit suits all is a question of choice and opinion.
    But the financial sector would have preferred the status quo obviously as they want to continue to make mountains of money on the backs of a very gullible population. The vote was an inconvenience but unlike Woody, they don't look to blame, they just work their way out of the problem. These people only look after themselves, where and how they do that is of no consequence to them.
    Like our US cousins they believe they are an exceptional and indispensable people, but if you know how the system works you will be aware that the Banks are a service to industry that has managed to create an 'industry' out of the service, an industry which ' we ' believe we cannot do without but it is in reality a parallel economy and has very little to do with the real economy.
    A complex and involved subject.

Long winded way of saying Yes. :wink:

Posted By: Woodrow Why?at

  • ProVox wrote:
    WW:
      Quote:
    • And I cannot believe that someone of your intellect can continue to deny the direct correlation between the vote to leave the EU and the fall of the Pound!

    That is where you fail ..... who says it is a direct correlation? Only you! If you read what I post very carefully you will, I am sure, note that what I am saying is that there is an INDIRECT association and the link between a direct and indirect correlation is ....... SPECULATION.
      Quote:
    • As for "Let's leave it at that".............sounds awfully like you're giving up

    No ......but unless you have something to support your hypothesis, there seems little point in continuing the discussion .......... we have said all that can be said staying within the context of the thread.

Firstly, I think you'll find that it is not 'only me' that realises the bleedin' obvious - that there is a direct correlation! :roll:
Secondly, I have read your posts v e r y c a r e f u l l y ( although God knows, it's not easy! :lol: ) and I have seen no instance where you have accepted that there is even an INDIRECT correlation.....until now - so we are getting there!! \:D/
As for 'something to support my hypothesis', I have demonstrated time and time again that it is not an 'hypothesis' but an indisputable FACT!! 8)

Posted By: ProVox

Oh well, you obviously don’t want me to ‘give up’ on you so as its too hot to do anything outside at the moment you have my attention.
In reply (I’ll try to keep it simple!) :
    Quote:
  • Firstly, I think you'll find that it is not 'only me' that realises the bleedin' obvious - that there is a direct correlation!

It is an indirect correlation ......... it cannot be otherwise as the second event has yet to happen.
    Quote:
  • Secondly, I have read your posts v e r y c a r e f u l l y ( although God knows, it's not easy! ) and I have seen no instance where you have accepted that there is even an INDIRECT correlation.....until now - so we are getting there!!

It would be difficult to understand if your opinion cluttered your thinking, which it does? Let me refer you to:
My Post 32 – Well, at least we agree that the change in the rate is as a consequence of speculation!
My post 37 - It is the excuse the speculators use to keep the rate on a see-saw and based on nothing other than computers buying and selling currency in enormous amounts on a few strokes on some speculators computer key board !
..... and of course post 57 where I spelt it out so even the most limited intellect would get the picture. So simplicity got the message over although you still disagree.
The vote result was one event ....... actually leaving the EU is another totally separate event which has not happened yet. Hence nothing in practical terms has changed.
These were two completely separate events, but you treat them as one and claim that as the reason for the decline in the value of the pound. The only entity that links the two is the currency speculation ..... nothing else.
The vote/result is a fact ....... leaving the EU is a probability. It can’t be a fact as it has yet to happen. Your hypothesis is only valid if your observations occur AFTER the UK leaves the EU.
Why do you find that so hard to understand?

    Quote:
  • As for 'something to support my hypothesis', I have demonstrated time and time again that it is not an 'hypothesis' but an indisputable FACT!!

See above ..... you have a fact, a vote/result and a probability ( say 95% probable, but still only a probability that we will leave the EU ) it is NOT a fact and not a certainty by any means. You cannot treat them as being one and the same! That is illogical.
So back to square one ....... the people voted to leave the EU ....... this result is used by currency speculators as a reason to sell the pound to buy other currencies in larger volumes than is normal ..... so the pound drops ...... but we are still in the EU so nothing in practical terms has changed. So speculation caused the drop .... not the result of the referendum.
Just a thought ..... had the result been announced after midnight on the Friday, the rate would not have changed until Monday morning ...... unless the speculators worked week-end overtime. My hypothesis!
:wink:

Posted By: FSB Properties

1 GBP = 1.1422 EUR 1 EUR = 0.8755 GBP 17 July 2017 09:22

Posted By: Jacs

  • FSB Properties wrote:
    1 GBP = 1.1422 EUR
    1 EUR = 0.8755 GBP
    17 July 2017 09:22

I wish there was a like button. 😁

Posted By: Woodrow Why?at

  • ProVox wrote:
    Oh well, you obviously don’t want me to ‘give up’ on you so as its too hot to do anything outside at the moment you have my attention.
    In reply (I’ll try to keep it simple!) :
      Quote:
    • Firstly, I think you'll find that it is not 'only me' that realises the bleedin' obvious - that there is a direct correlation!

    It is an indirect correlation ......... it cannot be otherwise as the second event has yet to happen.
      Quote:
    • Secondly, I have read your posts v e r y c a r e f u l l y ( although God knows, it's not easy! ) and I have seen no instance where you have accepted that there is even an INDIRECT correlation.....until now - so we are getting there!!

    It would be difficult to understand if your opinion cluttered your thinking, which it does? Let me refer you to:
    My Post 32 – Well, at least we agree that the change in the rate is as a consequence of speculation!
    My post 37 - It is the excuse the speculators use to keep the rate on a see-saw and based on nothing other than computers buying and selling currency in enormous amounts on a few strokes on some speculators computer key board !
    ..... and of course post 57 where I spelt it out so even the most limited intellect would get the picture. So simplicity got the message over although you still disagree.
    The vote result was one event ....... actually leaving the EU is another totally separate event which has not happened yet. Hence nothing in practical terms has changed.
    These were two completely separate events, but you treat them as one and claim that as the reason for the decline in the value of the pound. The only entity that links the two is the currency speculation ..... nothing else.
    The vote/result is a fact ....... leaving the EU is a probability. It can’t be a fact as it has yet to happen. Your hypothesis is only valid if your observations occur AFTER the UK leaves the EU.
    Why do you find that so hard to understand?

      Quote:
    • As for 'something to support my hypothesis', I have demonstrated time and time again that it is not an 'hypothesis' but an indisputable FACT!!

    See above ..... you have a fact, a vote/result and a probability ( say 95% probable, but still only a probability that we will leave the EU ) it is NOT a fact and not a certainty by any means. You cannot treat them as being one and the same! That is illogical.
    So back to square one ....... the people voted to leave the EU ....... this result is used by currency speculators as a reason to sell the pound to buy other currencies in larger volumes than is normal ..... so the pound drops ...... but we are still in the EU so nothing in practical terms has changed. So speculation caused the drop .... not the result of the referendum.
    Just a thought ..... had the result been announced after midnight on the Friday, the rate would not have changed until Monday morning ...... unless the speculators worked week-end overtime. My hypothesis!
    :wink:

PV, may I begin by saying how much I appreciate your effort to try and keep it simple - I fully realise what a challenge that must be for you! :wink:
However, after giving it some deep thought (and I'll accept that's a challenge for me! :lol: ) I believe I can see where you are getting confused on the matter in hand! :P
It is YOU, not me, who refuses to recognise that leaving the EU and the vote to do so are "two completely separate events"!!
And it is YOU who keeps repeating that the decline in the value of the Pound cannot be attributed to the vote to leave the EU because we haven't yet left :?.
(Can you possibly see the contradiction?)
So, let's agree, these ARE two separate events, but what is totally illogical is to maintain the naive belief that the immediate 5% drop in Sterling, following the referendum, and on going devaluation is purely coincidental and nothing to do with said vote!! :roll: 8)

Posted By: Kwacka

  • ProVox wrote:

    Just a thought ..... had the result been announced after midnight on the Friday, the rate would not have changed until Monday morning ...... unless the speculators worked week-end overtime. My hypothesis!
    :wink:

Algorithms.

Posted By: ProVox

  • Kwacka wrote:
    • ProVox wrote:

      Just a thought ..... had the result been announced after midnight on the Friday, the rate would not have changed until Monday morning ...... unless the speculators worked week-end overtime. My hypothesis!
      :wink:

    Algorithms.

Same to you. :wink: :lol:
Seriously, if you look at the rate over a one day period, when the speculators are at home over the weekend the movement looks quite dramatic and I suspect, although the time scale does not go down to seconds, there is continuous activity which last maybe even fractions of a second.
But look at it closely and the peak-to-trough is only around two or three ten thousand fractions of a Euro.
That must be a terrific contribution to the economy and all based on algorithms which very few people, except these 'quants', seem to know how they work. :roll:

Posted By: DAC

  • ProVox wrote:

    That must be a terrific contribution to the economy and all based on algorithms which very few people, except these 'quants', seem to know how they work. :roll:

The main factor behind FX is not one of how much you are prepared to gain, but more of one of how much you are prepared to loose. When it came to the Brexit referendum night the traders had opened "Long" positions on the belief, exit polls and market sentiment, that the 'Remain' camp would win and that the GBP would gain value against the € but the problem is, is that you only make gains from a "Long" position when you sell. That alone s a pretty good indicator that had the GBP gained overnight value against the € that those gains would only have been temporary as the markets would then have all been keen to sell GBP, creating another slide. Why?
Because, and as has already been mentioned, Algorithms and Traders would also have opened many many "Short" positions in anticipation of a slide in value of the GBP against the Euro, and also, and probably more importantly, a slide in value of the GBP against the USD as the USD is the currency that all money flows to when the markets are unsure of where to park their funds.
Basically, either way the referendum vote went, the GBP/EUR and GBP/USD pairing was always going to see lots of activity and volatility. Plus, markets around the world are always open it's just that most trade takes place during the trading hours of the UK and US trading periods. Plus, the GBP/EUR has probably also remained low because of uncertainty and also because it benefits the UK economy for the GBP to be low as it helps to boost exports and also boost tourism to the UK.

Posted By: ProVox

WW:
    Quote:
  • PV, may I begin by saying how much I appreciate your effort to try and keep it simple - I fully realise what a challenge that must be for you!

As an engineer, to explain to those with less knowledge than I had, it was necessary to be precise and explain in detail because there are a lot of people out there like you, and there is nothing worse than someone making a decision from a position of ignorance.
    Quote:

  • However, after giving it some deep thought (and I'll accept that's a challenge for me! ) I believe I can see where you are getting confused on the matter in hand!

there’s a clever boy! Now let’s see if your confidence pans out?
    Quote:
  • It is YOU, not me, who refuses to recognise that leaving the EU and the vote to do so are "two completely separate events"!!

Well, obviously you either cannot read or are as thick as two short planks! I said ..... “ These were two completely separate events, but you treat them as one and claim that as the reason for the decline in the value of the pound. The only entity that links the two is the currency speculation ..... nothing else .”
    Quote:
  • And it is YOU who keeps repeating that the decline in the value of the Pound cannot be attributed to the vote to leave the EU because we haven't yet left .
    (Can you possibly see the contradiction?)

No contradiction .... I see that as a fairly logical conclusion. Believe it or not .... I am not stupid! The actual vote result changed NOTHING. Therefore any action attributed to the vote is simple speculation.
What happens if tomorrow the Euro is subject to a claim that a massive Italian bank collapse was imminent, the Euro drops like a stone and the pound rises ....... was it the Brexit vote that was the cause or the prospect or an Italian banking collapse? Answer ..... NEITHER because it was speculation not the actual event that caused the drop in the Euro.
It will be 20 months before a Brexit is implemented! Then the result of the vote can be directly linked to the outcome.
    Quote:

  • So, let's agree, these ARE two separate events, but what is totally illogical is to maintain the naive belief that the immediate 5% drop in Sterling, following the referendum, and on going devaluation is purely coincidental and nothing to do with said vote

We agree that they are two separate event’s ............ at long last
.
My ‘ naive ’ belief is that the drop of 5% was triggered by the result ...... but it was speculation that can be blamed for the 5% drop, the vote was not the cause. What you are saying with contempt is that the Brexiteers were responsible for that drop. With that I disagree and maintain the drop was due to speculation of a future event. Basic common sense ...... something that has not happened cannot directly influence an event that has happened.
Anyway, let’s drop it as we won’t know for some 20 months what the effect will be...... but maybe I should blame May and her team now as it is obvious they are not very good negotiators ..... in fact just as bad as Cameron! But if it is a good result .... then the Brexiteers will have been proved to have done the right thing.
:roll: :wink:

Posted By: Kwacka

  • ProVox wrote:

    We agree that they are two separate event’s ............ at long last
    .
    My ‘ naive ’ belief is that the drop of 5% was triggered by the result ...... but it was speculation that can be blamed for the 5% drop, the vote was not the cause. What you are saying with contempt is that the Brexiteers were responsible for that drop. With that I disagree and maintain the drop was due to speculation of a future event. Basic common sense ...... something that has not happened cannot directly influence an event that has happened.
    Anyway, let’s drop it as we won’t know for some 20 months what the effect will be...... but maybe I should blame May and her team now as it is obvious they are not very good negotiators ..... in fact just as bad as Cameron! But if it is a good result .... then the Brexiteers will have been proved to have done the right thing.
    :roll: :wink:

1. More people voted to leave than the number who voted to stay,
2. Coincidentally, it was recognised that the UK would be leaving the EU,
3. Coincidentally, those that make a living buying and selling moneys' computers decided that it was safer to flog pounds and buy dollars, euros, anything else.
:roll:

Posted By: mouse

  • Kwacka wrote:
    • ProVox wrote:

      We agree that they are two separate event’s ............ at long last
      .
      My ‘ naive ’ belief is that the drop of 5% was triggered by the result ...... but it was speculation that can be blamed for the 5% drop, the vote was not the cause. What you are saying with contempt is that the Brexiteers were responsible for that drop. With that I disagree and maintain the drop was due to speculation of a future event. Basic common sense ...... something that has not happened cannot directly influence an event that has happened.
      Anyway, let’s drop it as we won’t know for some 20 months what the effect will be...... but maybe I should blame May and her team now as it is obvious they are not very good negotiators ..... in fact just as bad as Cameron! But if it is a good result .... then the Brexiteers will have been proved to have done the right thing.
      :roll: :wink:

    1. More people voted to leave than the number who voted to stay,
    2. Coincidentally, it was recognised that the UK would be leaving the EU,
    3. Coincidentally, those that make a living buying and selling moneys' computers decided that it was safer to flog pounds and buy dollars, euros, anything else.
    :roll:

Stop using common sense and facts, it's not fair.
It confuses. Some. :wink:

Posted By: ProVox

Kwacka:
    Quote:
  • 1. More people voted to leave than the number who voted to stay,

Hence the result, we were still a member on the 24th June 2016 and still are. So no change there then?
    Quote:

  • 2. Coincidentally, it was recognised that the UK would be leaving the EU,

Not by’ remoaners’ they want another referendum until the populace get it right. Now they have Blairs support so it is not a certainty merely speculative whichever way you look at it.
    Quote:

  • 3. Coincidentally, those that make a living buying and selling moneys' computers decided that it was safer to flog pounds and buy dollars, euros, anything else.

Those that buy and sell money, speculators, determine its rate of exchange and they are interested only in profits. They do it by speculation .... and can chose any event as a ‘reason’. It is all a game that has nothing to do with economics or even remotely adds anything to the real economy.
I don’t see the point of your post!

Posted By: jeba

  • ProVox wrote:

    Those that buy and sell money, speculators, determine its rate of exchange and they are interested only in profits. They do it by speculation .... and can chose any event as a ‘reason’. It is all a game that has nothing to do with economics or even remotely adds anything to the real economy.

Don´t you think that "speculation" has a lot to do with expectations of events happening in the "real economy"? What if e. g. the goverment declared that as of next year dividends will be taxed at a rate of 100%? Don´t you think that this would cause share prices to drop even before that new tax law came into effect?

Posted By: Woodrow Why?at

  • ProVox wrote:
    WW:
      Quote:
    • PV, may I begin by saying how much I appreciate your effort to try and keep it simple - I fully realise what a challenge that must be for you!

    As an engineer, to explain to those with less knowledge than I had, it was necessary to be precise and explain in detail because there are a lot of people out there like you, and there is nothing worse than someone making a decision from a position of ignorance.
      Quote:

    • However, after giving it some deep thought (and I'll accept that's a challenge for me! ) I believe I can see where you are getting confused on the matter in hand!

    there’s a clever boy! Now let’s see if your confidence pans out?
      Quote:
    • It is YOU, not me, who refuses to recognise that leaving the EU and the vote to do so are "two completely separate events"!!

    Well, obviously you either cannot read or are as thick as two short planks! I said ..... “ These were two completely separate events, but you treat them as one and claim that as the reason for the decline in the value of the pound. The only entity that links the two is the currency speculation ..... nothing else .”
      Quote:
    • And it is YOU who keeps repeating that the decline in the value of the Pound cannot be attributed to the vote to leave the EU because we haven't yet left .
      (Can you possibly see the contradiction?)

    No contradiction .... I see that as a fairly logical conclusion. Believe it or not .... I am not stupid! The actual vote result changed NOTHING. Therefore any action attributed to the vote is simple speculation.
    What happens if tomorrow the Euro is subject to a claim that a massive Italian bank collapse was imminent, the Euro drops like a stone and the pound rises ....... was it the Brexit vote that was the cause or the prospect or an Italian banking collapse? Answer ..... NEITHER because it was speculation not the actual event that caused the drop in the Euro.
    It will be 20 months before a Brexit is implemented! Then the result of the vote can be directly linked to the outcome.
      Quote:

    • So, let's agree, these ARE two separate events, but what is totally illogical is to maintain the naive belief that the immediate 5% drop in Sterling, following the referendum, and on going devaluation is purely coincidental and nothing to do with said vote

    We agree that they are two separate event’s ............ at long last
    .
    My ‘ naive ’ belief is that the drop of 5% was triggered by the result ...... but it was speculation that can be blamed for the 5% drop, the vote was not the cause. What you are saying with contempt is that the Brexiteers were responsible for that drop. With that I disagree and maintain the drop was due to speculation of a future event. Basic common sense ...... something that has not happened cannot directly influence an event that has happened.
    Anyway, let’s drop it as we won’t know for some 20 months what the effect will be...... but maybe I should blame May and her team now as it is obvious they are not very good negotiators ..... in fact just as bad as Cameron! But if it is a good result .... then the Brexiteers will have been proved to have done the right thing.
    :roll: :wink:

.....In that, as I can read perfectly well, I must be "as thick as two short planks"! :oops: :lol: because I assimilate that what you've written on this issue is full of contradictions, false assumptions and illogical nonsense!! 8)

Posted By: ProVox

  • Woodrow Why?at wrote:
    • ProVox wrote:
      WW:
        Quote:
      • PV, may I begin by saying how much I appreciate your effort to try and keep it simple - I fully realise what a challenge that must be for you!

      As an engineer, to explain to those with less knowledge than I had, it was necessary to be precise and explain in detail because there are a lot of people out there like you, and there is nothing worse than someone making a decision from a position of ignorance.
        Quote:

      • However, after giving it some deep thought (and I'll accept that's a challenge for me! ) I believe I can see where you are getting confused on the matter in hand!

      there’s a clever boy! Now let’s see if your confidence pans out?
        Quote:
      • It is YOU, not me, who refuses to recognise that leaving the EU and the vote to do so are "two completely separate events"!!

      Well, obviously you either cannot read or are as thick as two short planks! I said ..... “ These were two completely separate events, but you treat them as one and claim that as the reason for the decline in the value of the pound. The only entity that links the two is the currency speculation ..... nothing else .”
        Quote:
      • And it is YOU who keeps repeating that the decline in the value of the Pound cannot be attributed to the vote to leave the EU because we haven't yet left .
        (Can you possibly see the contradiction?)

      No contradiction .... I see that as a fairly logical conclusion. Believe it or not .... I am not stupid! The actual vote result changed NOTHING. Therefore any action attributed to the vote is simple speculation.
      What happens if tomorrow the Euro is subject to a claim that a massive Italian bank collapse was imminent, the Euro drops like a stone and the pound rises ....... was it the Brexit vote that was the cause or the prospect or an Italian banking collapse? Answer ..... NEITHER because it was speculation not the actual event that caused the drop in the Euro.
      It will be 20 months before a Brexit is implemented! Then the result of the vote can be directly linked to the outcome.
        Quote:

      • So, let's agree, these ARE two separate events, but what is totally illogical is to maintain the naive belief that the immediate 5% drop in Sterling, following the referendum, and on going devaluation is purely coincidental and nothing to do with said vote

      We agree that they are two separate event’s ............ at long last
      .
      My ‘ naive ’ belief is that the drop of 5% was triggered by the result ...... but it was speculation that can be blamed for the 5% drop, the vote was not the cause. What you are saying with contempt is that the Brexiteers were responsible for that drop. With that I disagree and maintain the drop was due to speculation of a future event. Basic common sense ...... something that has not happened cannot directly influence an event that has happened.
      Anyway, let’s drop it as we won’t know for some 20 months what the effect will be...... but maybe I should blame May and her team now as it is obvious they are not very good negotiators ..... in fact just as bad as Cameron! But if it is a good result .... then the Brexiteers will have been proved to have done the right thing.
      :roll: :wink:

    .....In that, as I can read perfectly well, I must be "as thick as two short planks"! :oops: :lol: because I assimilate that what you've written on this issue is full of contradictions, false assumptions and illogical nonsense!! 8)

I see you as using only what suits your argument with total disregard for reality. Your mind is cluttered with long held misconceptions. Only time will tell who has the logical and pragmatic approach and who is living an illusion.
BTW: I didn't see the GBP leap in value at the prospect of remaining in the EU as proposed by Blair. So obviously remoaners opinions have less effect than the Brexiteers opinions.

Posted By: Woodrow Why?at

Yes 'cause and effect' is a misconception I've held for some time!! :lol: :lol:

Posted By: Pete The Highwayman

Morning woody In today's marvellous daily mail in yesterday's money markets The euro was trading at a tad under 1"14 And I'm sorry to see you as a lifelong labour supporter But if you come from green street green it makes sense Keep smiling and be lucky Pete

Posted By: mouse

  • ProVox wrote:
    • Woodrow Why?at wrote:
      • ProVox wrote:
        WW:
          Quote:
        • PV, may I begin by saying how much I appreciate your effort to try and keep it simple - I fully realise what a challenge that must be for you!

        As an engineer, to explain to those with less knowledge than I had, it was necessary to be precise and explain in detail because there are a lot of people out there like you, and there is nothing worse than someone making a decision from a position of ignorance.
          Quote:

        • However, after giving it some deep thought (and I'll accept that's a challenge for me! ) I believe I can see where you are getting confused on the matter in hand!

        there’s a clever boy! Now let’s see if your confidence pans out?
          Quote:
        • It is YOU, not me, who refuses to recognise that leaving the EU and the vote to do so are "two completely separate events"!!

        Well, obviously you either cannot read or are as thick as two short planks! I said ..... “ These were two completely separate events, but you treat them as one and claim that as the reason for the decline in the value of the pound. The only entity that links the two is the currency speculation ..... nothing else .”
          Quote:
        • And it is YOU who keeps repeating that the decline in the value of the Pound cannot be attributed to the vote to leave the EU because we haven't yet left .
          (Can you possibly see the contradiction?)

        No contradiction .... I see that as a fairly logical conclusion. Believe it or not .... I am not stupid! The actual vote result changed NOTHING. Therefore any action attributed to the vote is simple speculation.
        What happens if tomorrow the Euro is subject to a claim that a massive Italian bank collapse was imminent, the Euro drops like a stone and the pound rises ....... was it the Brexit vote that was the cause or the prospect or an Italian banking collapse? Answer ..... NEITHER because it was speculation not the actual event that caused the drop in the Euro.
        It will be 20 months before a Brexit is implemented! Then the result of the vote can be directly linked to the outcome.
          Quote:

        • So, let's agree, these ARE two separate events, but what is totally illogical is to maintain the naive belief that the immediate 5% drop in Sterling, following the referendum, and on going devaluation is purely coincidental and nothing to do with said vote

        We agree that they are two separate event’s ............ at long last
        .
        My ‘ naive ’ belief is that the drop of 5% was triggered by the result ...... but it was speculation that can be blamed for the 5% drop, the vote was not the cause. What you are saying with contempt is that the Brexiteers were responsible for that drop. With that I disagree and maintain the drop was due to speculation of a future event. Basic common sense ...... something that has not happened cannot directly influence an event that has happened.
        Anyway, let’s drop it as we won’t know for some 20 months what the effect will be...... but maybe I should blame May and her team now as it is obvious they are not very good negotiators ..... in fact just as bad as Cameron! But if it is a good result .... then the Brexiteers will have been proved to have done the right thing.
        :roll: :wink:

      .....In that, as I can read perfectly well, I must be "as thick as two short planks"! :oops: :lol: because I assimilate that what you've written on this issue is full of contradictions, false assumptions and illogical nonsense!! 8)

    I see you as using only what suits your argument with total disregard for reality. Your mind is cluttered with long held misconceptions. Only time will tell who has the logical and pragmatic approach and who is living an illusion.
    BTW: I didn't see the GBP leap in value at the prospect of remaining in the EU as proposed by Blair. So obviously remoaners opinions have less effect than the Brexiteers opinions.

Could it be because he is not part of the UK negotiating Team, or the EU team for that matter, and is not talking for the UK electorate who voted out.
And as has been said the NO vote means No, there is no going back.
Both sides have stated this many times.
So might be a clue there. :roll:

Posted By: ProVox

  • Pete The Highwayman wrote:
    Morning woody
    In today's marvellous daily mail in yesterday's money markets
    The euro was trading at a tad under 1"14
    And I'm sorry to see you as a lifelong labour supporter
    But if you come from green street green it makes sense
    Keep smiling and be lucky
    Pete

How strange ..... I lived in Green Street Green( Early 70's ) .....but then I had no interest in politics. BTW Green Street Green like its neighbour Orpington, was Liberal as I remember. :?:

Posted By: Pete The Highwayman

Pro fox I was talking about the street in East Ham green st green Is where the hammers old Boleyn ground was Pete

Posted By: ProVox

  • Woodrow Why?at wrote:
    Yes 'cause and effect' is a misconception I've held for some time!! :lol: :lol:

The trouble is, you don't know which is which!
Cause = Cameron calls a referendum ....... effect = Leave ....... effect = Currency speculation ........ effect = currency (GBP) falls in value. Result ...... pi**es off some paid in GBP, who then blame the voters for their loss, which of course was down to the speculators!
Depends on where you start the time line! If Cameron had not called for a referendum ...... then no Brexit ....... no abnormal currency speculation ...... GBP remains in its state of gradual decline.
One thing is for sure it would not have remained at its peak value which you use to calculate your losses? :roll:

Posted By: Woodrow Why?at

  • ProVox wrote:
    • Woodrow Why?at wrote:
      Yes 'cause and effect' is a misconception I've held for some time!! :lol: :lol:

    The trouble is, you don't know which is which!
    Cause = Cameron calls a referendum ....... effect = Leave ....... effect = Currency speculation ........ effect = currency (GBP) falls in value. Result ...... pi**es off some paid in GBP, who then blame the voters for their loss, which of course was down to the speculators!
    Depends on where you start the time line! If Cameron had not called for a referendum ...... then no Brexit ....... no abnormal currency speculation ...... GBP remains in its state of gradual decline.
    One thing is for sure it would not have remained at its peak value which you use to calculate your losses? :roll:

Well call me thick (oops sorry, you already have! :lol: ) but I was thinking more along the lines of.......Cause = Vote to Leave.......Effect = Immediate and on going reduction in the value of Sterling! 8)
(Another oops :oops:, I forgot that was just a 'coincidence'!! :roll: :lol: )
And on what irrefutable basis do you determine that the Pound would have lost its value regardless of any outside influences? :?

Posted By: ProVox

WW:
    Quote:
  • Well call me thick (oops sorry, you already have! ) but I was thinking more along the lines of.......Cause = Vote to Leave.......Effect = Immediate and on going reduction in the value of Sterling!
    (Another oops , I forgot that was just a 'coincidence'!! )

As I said your are economical with the facts and chose to leave out that which does not support your opinion.
There could have been no vote without Cameron calling a referendum ......... immediate cause was Camerons referendum.
    Quote:
  • And on what irrefutable basis do you determine that the Pound would have lost its value regardless of any outside influences?

Try this or is it too detailed for you? I would say the figures are irrefutable.
This goes from mid 2007 to just a minute or two ago .......today.
http://www.xe.com/currencycharts/?from=GBP&to=EUR&view=10Y
Note:
• From Mid 2007 to mid 2008 it went from 1.50 to a low of 1.03
• From mid 2008 to beginning of 2015 it went from a low of 1.03 to a high of 1.44, but still down by 0.06 on the previous high of 1.50
• From beginning of 2015 (18 months before the vote) it went from a high of 1.44 to a low just before the vote of 1.30, down by 0.14 from the high.
• From the result of the vote until today it has gone from the peak of 1.30 to around 1.14.
So since the result of the vote the GBP has declined in value compared with the Euro from the immediately preceding peak by 0.16, that is over a thirteen month period.
Over the ten year period on the chart the GBP has declined from a peak of 1.50 to today’s 1.14 with an absolute low of 1.03 in mid 2008.
So, as I said the GBP has overall declined in value against the Euro over a period of ten years by 0.36 c on the Euro.
In my book that is an overall decline in value or do you have another source that refutes this.
Will it continue to decline?

IMO : NO ! It may drop a few cents here and there but once the details start emerging on the Brexit deal I think the speculators will cash in and send the GBP up again as, when you look at the problems with the banking systems in the Southern States of the EU, the Euro Zone is very unstable and a bail-in in any of these countries will collapse the Euro.
:roll:

Posted By: ProVox

  • DAC wrote:
    • ProVox wrote:

      That must be a terrific contribution to the economy and all based on algorithms which very few people, except these 'quants', seem to know how they work. :roll:

    The main factor behind FX is not one of how much you are prepared to gain, but more of one of how much you are prepared to loose. When it came to the Brexit referendum night the traders had opened "Long" positions on the belief, exit polls and market sentiment, that the 'Remain' camp would win and that the GBP would gain value against the € but the problem is, is that you only make gains from a "Long" position when you sell. That alone s a pretty good indicator that had the GBP gained overnight value against the € that those gains would only have been temporary as the markets would then have all been keen to sell GBP, creating another slide. Why?
    Because, and as has already been mentioned, Algorithms and Traders would also have opened many many "Short" positions in anticipation of a slide in value of the GBP against the Euro, and also, and probably more importantly, a slide in value of the GBP against the USD as the USD is the currency that all money flows to when the markets are unsure of where to park their funds.
    Basically, either way the referendum vote went, the GBP/EUR and GBP/USD pairing was always going to see lots of activity and volatility. Plus, markets around the world are always open it's just that most trade takes place during the trading hours of the UK and US trading periods. Plus, the GBP/EUR has probably also remained low because of uncertainty and also because it benefits the UK economy for the GBP to be low as it helps to boost exports and also boost tourism to the UK.

Thank you ......That is what I call a well thought out and reasoned reply!
As I read it you agree that it is currency traders that determine the value of one currency against another and the result of the referendum came as a bit of a shock to them ?
Economically for the UK as you say, it is an advantage to have a lower value for the GBP but is it not also a disadvantage as raw material costs rise, although not so important as the UK has now mainly a service based economy, but we also import a lot of stuff we used to make ourselves, so inflation then rises?
A question: Do you believe that the banks ( Investment banks ) contribute in any significant way to the REAL economy? Personally I can't see how they can as they do not create jobs ...... they make money on gains in rising asset prices, not from the creation of wealth.

Posted By: Kwacka

  • ProVox wrote:
    Kwacka:

    Quote:
  • 1. More people voted to leave than the number who voted to stay,

  • ProVox wrote:
    Hence the result, we were still a member on the 24th June 2016 and still are. So no change there then?

Despite the election in November, Obama was still the President at Xmas. So no change there then?
In the same way, a vote was taken and a result expected to stand.
    Quote:

  • 2. Coincidentally, it was recognised that the UK would be leaving the EU,

  • ProVox wrote:
    Not by’ remoaners’ they want another referendum until the populace get it right. Now they have Blairs support so it is not a certainty merely speculative whichever way you look at it.

The 'remoaners' label is largely fantasy. AFAICT, the vast majority of those that voted to leave said on the following day "we lost, so the UK is leaving - better get on with it ASAP".
The 'remoaners' tag has been trotted out every time some real news has been reported, or some idiotic statement has been made (e.g. German car-makers and their UK market means that the UK will get anything it wants).
IMHO, Blair's involvement would be the kiss of death for any project.
    Quote:

  • 3. Coincidentally, those that make a living buying and selling moneys' computers decided that it was safer to flog pounds and buy dollars, euros, anything else.

  • ProVox wrote:
    Those that buy and sell money, speculators, determine its rate of exchange and they are interested only in profits. They do it by speculation .... and can chose any event as a ‘reason’. It is all a game that has nothing to do with economics or even remotely adds anything to the real economy.

Yes I agree, they speculate that's what I meant by 'buying and selling money" and "flog pounds and buy euros and dollars".
But I disagree with your suggestion that they choose 'any event' as a 'reason'. I don't think people like Soros got mega-rich by sticking on a blindfold and throwing a dart at a map of the world.
I think it more likely that they use super-computers running currency trading algorithms to respond to changes into countries political/social/economic state several times a second to make the decision to buy or sell.
Unless, possibly, the first dart hit the UK on June 24th, which would account for the drop in the UK pound - nothing of relevance happened then, did it?
  • ProVox wrote:
    I don’t see the point of your post!

I'm not surprised.

Posted By: Woodrow Why?at

  • ProVox wrote:
    WW:
      Quote:
    • Well call me thick (oops sorry, you already have! ) but I was thinking more along the lines of.......Cause = Vote to Leave.......Effect = Immediate and on going reduction in the value of Sterling!
      (Another oops , I forgot that was just a 'coincidence'!! )

    As I said your are economical with the facts and chose to leave out that which does not support your opinion.
    There could have been no vote without Cameron calling a referendum ......... immediate cause was Camerons referendum.
      Quote:
    • And on what irrefutable basis do you determine that the Pound would have lost its value regardless of any outside influences?

    Try this or is it too detailed for you? I would say the figures are irrefutable.
    This goes from mid 2007 to just a minute or two ago .......today.
    http://www.xe.com/currencycharts/?from=GBP&to=EUR&view=10Y
    Note:
    • From Mid 2007 to mid 2008 it went from 1.50 to a low of 1.03
    • From mid 2008 to beginning of 2015 it went from a low of 1.03 to a high of 1.44, but still down by 0.06 on the previous high of 1.50
    • From beginning of 2015 (18 months before the vote) it went from a high of 1.44 to a low just before the vote of 1.30, down by 0.14 from the high.
    • From the result of the vote until today it has gone from the peak of 1.30 to around 1.14.
    So since the result of the vote the GBP has declined in value compared with the Euro from the immediately preceding peak by 0.16, that is over a thirteen month period.
    Over the ten year period on the chart the GBP has declined from a peak of 1.50 to today’s 1.14 with an absolute low of 1.03 in mid 2008.
    So, as I said the GBP has overall declined in value against the Euro over a period of ten years by 0.36 c on the Euro.
    In my book that is an overall decline in value or do you have another source that refutes this.
    Will it continue to decline?

    IMO : NO ! It may drop a few cents here and there but once the details start emerging on the Brexit deal I think the speculators will cash in and send the GBP up again as, when you look at the problems with the banking systems in the Southern States of the EU, the Euro Zone is very unstable and a bail-in in any of these countries will collapse the Euro.
    :roll:

Not sure what facts I've left out which doesn't support my opinion :? but I'll admit to being more concise than you, and tend to only mention relevant details! 8)
For instance, I saw no point in stating the bleedin' obvious that no vote could have taken place if Cameron hadn't called a referendum! :roll:
And yes, since you ask, your history of the Pound/Euro exchange rate was not only too detailed but totally irrelevant! It did indeed provide 'irrefutable' evidence of what has gone before but, as we all know, that can not be taken as an indication to what might happen in the future!! 8)

Posted By: DAC

  • ProVox wrote:

    Thank you ......That is what I call a well thought out and reasoned reply!
    As I read it you agree that it is currency traders that determine the value of one currency against another and the result of the referendum came as a bit of a shock to them ?

Going by the way that the currency pairings went that night then yes, they were caught with their pants down as they'd assumed that the vote was going to go the other way. There was a temporary spike in the GBP/EUR pairing but as further results came in it went into a rapid decline. Why the decline? Uncertainty/Panic/Time of day/Project Fear/The media - especially the Media as they are all keen to be the the news breakers.
All these factors play a part as like I said in my other post currency trading is as much about how much you're prepared to lose as it is about how much you want to gain. A common FX mantra is this "Let your profits run and cut your loses early".
  • ProVox wrote:
    Economically for the UK as you say, it is an advantage to have a lower value for the GBP but is it not also a disadvantag e as raw material costs rise, although not so important as the UK has now mainly a service based economy, but we also import a lot of stuff we used to make ourselves, so inflation then rises?

I don't have the current figures to hand but the last time I looked the Financial Services Sector in the UK, primarily the City of London, and the services sector in general, paid more in taxes to the exchequer than of any other sector so like you say, the import cost of raw materials may be higher but I can only assume that the government see that as a price worth paying in the short to medium term.
  • ProVox wrote:
    A question: Do you believe that the banks ( Investment banks ) contribute in any significant way to the REAL economy? Personally I can't see how they can as they do not create jobs ...... they make money on gains in rising asset prices, not from the creation of wealth.

Hard one to answer really as although they're not traditional employers in that they have hundreds of people working in plants and factories, vast sums of the money that they trade is done so for investment portfolios/pension funds/retail banks so as such then yes, they do, as the banks lend money and the recipients of the pensions spend it within the wider economy.

Posted By: ProVox

Kwacka:
    Quote:
  • Despite the election in November, Obama was still the President at Xmas. So no change there then?


Precisely ..... the changes only came in AFTER the result of the vote was implemented and Trump took the reins. The same with the UK vote ...... nothing changed ......... it will change when we know the details and that could well see the pound rise as easily as it could see it fall. But add the Eurozone vulnerability to the equation and ..... anything is possible.
    Quote:
  • In the same way, a vote was taken and a result expected to stand.

It is a probability ......... but things could change that we know nothing about yet.
    Quote:
  • IMHO, Blair's involvement would be the kiss of death for any project

I agree with you but he’s a slimy SOB.
.
    Quote:
  • ....... that's what I meant by 'buying and selling money".......

Er, not quite accurate. A Bureau-de-change ‘ buys and sells money ’ but they have no influence on the rates ..... they get that info from the banks. Currency speculators define the market value.
    Quote:
  • I think it more likely that they use super-computers running currency trading algorithms to respond to changes into countries political/social/economic state several times a second to make the decision to buy or sell.

That is why the Investment Banks have shed so many jobs. Computers do it far better than a trader and certainly orders of magnitude faster.
:roll:

Posted By: ProVox

WW
    Quote:
  • Not sure what facts I've left out which doesn't support my opinion but I'll admit to being more concise than you, and tend to only mention relevant details!

I think ‘selective’ would more concise and the details you use are only those you deem relevant!
    Quote:
  • For instance, I saw no point in stating the bleedin' obvious that no vote could have taken place if Cameron hadn't called a referendum!

Of course it’s obvious but it was the cause and the result was the effect of that vote invoking abnormal currency speculation.
    Quote:
  • And yes, since you ask, your history of the Pound/Euro exchange rate was not only too detailed but totally irrelevant! It did indeed provide 'irrefutable' evidence of what has gone before but, as we all know, that can not be taken as an indication to what might happen in the future!!

You asked .....” And on what irrefutable basis do you determine that the Pound would have (past tense!!!!) lost its value regardless of any outside influences?”
I don’t have a crystal ball like you so that I can foresee a future of doom and gloom caused by dense idiots who just maybe saw more to it than you.

It obviously was too difficult for you! It could be called ‘follow the trend’ ..... the trend over 10 years has been down but you seem to think that is irrelevant and only events from June 2016 count? OK ..... take that if you wish ..... and the trend is still down but of course that is only due to the Brexit decision and nothing to do with currency speculators?
:roll:

Posted By: Gerry McMahon

Weve still got another couple of years at least of this,blame BREXIT no good to Man or Beast,or even expat pensioners. :x

Posted By: Woodrow Why?at

  • ProVox wrote:
    WW
      Quote:
    • Not sure what facts I've left out which doesn't support my opinion but I'll admit to being more concise than you, and tend to only mention relevant details!

    I think ‘selective’ would more concise and the details you use are only those you deem relevant!
      Quote:
    • For instance, I saw no point in stating the bleedin' obvious that no vote could have taken place if Cameron hadn't called a referendum!

    Of course it’s obvious but it was the cause and the result was the effect of that vote invoking abnormal currency speculation.
      Quote:
    • And yes, since you ask, your history of the Pound/Euro exchange rate was not only too detailed but totally irrelevant! It did indeed provide 'irrefutable' evidence of what has gone before but, as we all know, that can not be taken as an indication to what might happen in the future!!

    You asked .....” And on what irrefutable basis do you determine that the Pound would have (past tense!!!!) lost its value regardless of any outside influences?”
    I don’t have a crystal ball like you so that I can foresee a future of doom and gloom caused by dense idiots who just maybe saw more to it than you.

    It obviously was too difficult for you! It could be called ‘follow the trend’ ..... the trend over 10 years has been down but you seem to think that is irrelevant and only events from June 2016 count? OK ..... take that if you wish ..... and the trend is still down but of course that is only due to the Brexit decision and nothing to do with currency speculators?
    :roll:

In your own words....."The RESULT was the effect of THAT VOTE invoking abnormal currency speculation."
So, after all this time maintaining that the VOTE had nothing whatsoever to do with the Pound's demise you've finally accepted that there was a connection!! \:D/

As far as me asking "on what irrefutable basis do you determine that the Pound would have lost it's value......." I was, obviously, referring to post referendum and therefore it was rather superfluous to provide rates going back ten years! :roll:
BTW, regarding your observation of "the details you use are only those you deem relevant" is concerned........why on Earth would I use details that I DON'T consider relevant? :? 8)

Posted By: ProVox

Goodness me .... you post like a simpleton!
WW:
    Quote:
  • In your own words....."The RESULT was the effect of THAT VOTE invoking abnormal currency speculation."

The result was the initiation of an abnormal series of actions by CURRENCY SPECULATORS .... the speculators NOT the result caused the fall in the rate.
    Quote:
  • So, after all this time maintaining that the VOTE had nothing whatsoever to do with the Pound's demise you've finally accepted that there was a connection!!

Yes .... a connection ..... but speculators caused the fall not voters an accusation which your posts consistently spout.
    Quote:
  • As far as me asking "on what irrefutable basis do you determine that the Pound would have lost it's value......." I was, obviously, referring to post referendum and therefore it was rather superfluous to provide rates going back ten years!

You asked a question I answered it. I don’t go in for crystal ball prophecies. The decline since the 25/6/16 rate of 1.23 to the present 1.13 is all down to speculation. Currency trading is the cause of currency fluctuations NOT referendums that occurred 13 months ago.
    Quote:
  • BTW, regarding your observation of "the details you use are only those you deem relevant" is concerned........why on Earth would I use details that I DON'T consider relevant?

If you leave out facts that counter your argument then your outcome is knowingly inaccurate ........... surely this is how conspiracy theories are proved and disproved .........,by looking at ALL the evidence.

Posted By: Woodrow Why?at

  • ProVox wrote:
    Goodness me .... you post like a simpleton!

Perhaps we'll leave it to others to judge which one of us 'posts like a simpleton' 8)
And bear in mind who it was who wrote "I think 'selective' would more concise" in reply to my admission of "being more concise than you," :roll: :lol: :lol:

Posted By: sugarray1955

  • Woodrow Why?at wrote:
    • ProVox wrote:
      Goodness me .... you post like a simpleton!

    Perhaps we'll leave it to others to judge which one of us 'posts like a simpleton' 8)
    And bear in mind who it was who wrote "I think 'selective' would more concise" in reply to my admission of "being more concise than you," :roll: :lol: :lol:

IMHO :) your posts are spot on, unfortunately certain people cannot see the wood for the trees and tend to think they know everything about everything :wink: Simpleton, definitely not :)

Posted By: Woodrow Why?at

  • sugarray1955 wrote:
    • Woodrow Why?at wrote:
      • ProVox wrote:
        Goodness me .... you post like a simpleton!

      Perhaps we'll leave it to others to judge which one of us 'posts like a simpleton' 8)
      And bear in mind who it was who wrote "I think 'selective' would more concise" in reply to my admission of "being more concise than you," :roll: :lol: :lol:

    IMHO :) your posts are spot on, unfortunately certain people cannot see the wood for the trees and tend to think they know everything about everything :wink: Simpleton, definitely not :)

Thanks for your support, sugarray, and I think your 'wood for the trees' comment was most apt! :D
Yes, of course traders/speculators are instrumental in setting the market price, but they are reacting to events not controlling them!
In this instance, they may have pulled the trigger but it was the VOTE which provided the ammunition and loaded the gun!!
(And yes PV, I'm aware there weren't actually any weapons involved!! :roll: :lol:)

Posted By: romatarot

Having followed this thread with increasing interest, I googled 'Who instructs currency speculators' and found this little gem. From a book entitled International Finance and Open-Economy Macroeconomics: Theory, History, and ... By Hendrik Van den Berg I discovered that the currency speculation market is unregulated and highly volatile. I am unwilling to copy the contents of the book without permission, so I've found the case of 'Operation Wooden Nickle', a case in 2003 in New York http://www.nytimes.com/2003/11/19/business/47-currency-traders-are-indicted-on-fraud-charges.html I find it difficult to believe that circumstances surrounding the pound sterling exchange rate have been influenced by one referendum vote alone.

Posted By: ProVox

  • romatarot wrote:
    Having followed this thread with increasing interest, I googled 'Who instructs currency speculators' and found this little gem. From a book entitled
    International Finance and Open-Economy Macroeconomics: Theory, History, and ...
    By Hendrik Van den Berg
    I discovered that the currency speculation market is unregulated and highly volatile. I am unwilling to copy the contents of the book without permission, so I've found the case of 'Operation Wooden Nickle', a case in 2003 in New York
    http://www.nytimes.com/2003/11/19/business/47-currency-traders-are-indicted-on-fraud-charges.html
    I find it difficult to believe that circumstances surrounding the pound sterling exchange rate have been influenced by one referendum vote alone.

You won't convince Woody, it was down to speculators! It's all down to dense idiots that voted to leave the Fourth Reich! The financial system in general is a case of Dell boy, uncle Albert and Rodney ..... in Saville Row suits!!!
Did you see yesterday that The Germans made 1.34 Billion Euros out of lending the Greeks money, they knew they could not afford to repay? That is why they got rid of Varoufakis ..... he mentioned odious debt which would have upset the Germans plans.
You may find this guys views interesting: Basically .... it all comes down to money at the end of the day.

http://www.globalresearch.ca/electronic-money-under-the-one-world-order-owo-are-we-on-the-verge-of-becoming-western-money-slaves-solutions-resistance-economy-de-dollarization-and-de-globalization/5600200

Posted By: DAC

  • ProVox wrote:

    Did you see yesterday that The Germans made 1.34 Billion Euros out of lending the Greeks money, they knew they could not afford to repay? That is why they got rid of Varoufakis ..... he mentioned odious debt which would have upset the Germans plans.
    You may find this guys views interesting: Basically .... it all comes down to money at the end of the day.


I've read his book, Varoufakis - The Global Minotaur, and it's a very interesting read. He highlights that when the ECB/IMF celebrate each and every bailout that they provide Greece with, that the sum of money that actually ends in Greece is actually, ZERO/ZILCH/NOTHING/NADA As it is simply used to repay the interest of the previous ones, i.e. they get not a single cent yet their national debt continues to increase.
An old army officer friend of mine is currently working within the annals of the EU and he spoke very highly of Yanis Varoufakis "He seriously knew his stuff economically speaking, but he couldn't play the game when he came to negotiate in Brussels. As a result he had to go because he became part of the negotiations problem so had to go". Basically forced out as he was upsetting the EU's political Union as they weren't focused on a financial one. Another elected politician that was forced out by the un-elected officials that haunt the EU.

Posted By: mouse

  • ProVox wrote:
    • romatarot wrote:
      Having followed this thread with increasing interest, I googled 'Who instructs currency speculators' and found this little gem. From a book entitled
      International Finance and Open-Economy Macroeconomics: Theory, History, and ...
      By Hendrik Van den Berg
      I discovered that the currency speculation market is unregulated and highly volatile. I am unwilling to copy the contents of the book without permission, so I've found the case of 'Operation Wooden Nickle', a case in 2003 in New York
      http://www.nytimes.com/2003/11/19/business/47-currency-traders-are-indicted-on-fraud-charges.html
      I find it difficult to believe that circumstances surrounding the pound sterling exchange rate have been influenced by one referendum vote alone.

    You won't convince Woody, it was down to speculators! It's all down to dense idiots that voted to leave the Fourth Reich! The financial system in general is a case of Dell boy, uncle Albert and Rodney ..... in Saville Row suits!!!
    Did you see yesterday that The Germans made 1.34 Billion Euros out of lending the Greeks money, they knew they could not afford to repay? That is why they got rid of Varoufakis ..... he mentioned odious debt which would have upset the Germans plans.
    You may find this guys views interesting: Basically .... it all comes down to money at the end of the day.

    http://www.globalresearch.ca/electronic-money-under-the-one-world-order-owo-are-we-on-the-verge-of-becoming-western-money-slaves-solutions-resistance-economy-de-dollarization-and-de-globalization/5600200

Of course it was down to speculators, but the speculators at the time liked the idea of staying in the EU rather than leaving it.
Do you agree with that statement.

Posted By: Woodrow Why?at

  • romatarot wrote:
    Having followed this thread with increasing interest, I googled 'Who instructs currency speculators' and found this little gem. From a book entitled
    International Finance and Open-Economy Macroeconomics: Theory, History, and ...
    By Hendrik Van den Berg
    I discovered that the currency speculation market is unregulated and highly volatile. I am unwilling to copy the contents of the book without permission, so I've found the case of 'Operation Wooden Nickle', a case in 2003 in New York
    http://www.nytimes.com/2003/11/19/business/47-currency-traders-are-indicted-on-fraud-charges.html
    I find it difficult to believe that circumstances surrounding the pound sterling exchange rate have been influenced by one referendum vote alone.

I'm not aware that I - or anyone else - has ever stated that the downturn in the value of the Pound is down to the referendum result 'alone' but there can be no denying (what am I saying :roll: ) that it has had a major influence!! 8)

Posted By: ProVox

DAC:
    Quote:
  • I've read his book, Varoufakis - The Global Minotaur, and it's a very interesting read. He highlights that when the ECB/IMF celebrate each and every bailout that they provide Greece with, that the sum of money that actually ends in Greece is actually, ZERO/ZILCH/NOTHING/NADA As it is simply used to repay the interest of the previous ones, i.e. they get not a single cent yet their national debt continues to increase.

It gets even worse when you realise that these bankers have foreclosed on Greece' assts. Almost everything from railways to ports, are owned now by foreigners.
What did I say about bankers contributions to the UK economy? The same happens with income tax paid by bankers, it’s a lot of money but it is exactly the same story as the Greek loans. It is used to repay debt and adds nothing to the economy. But the UK can always increase its debt because it has a sovereign currency but Greece has the Euro!
I always agreed with Varoufakis’ approach to economics, although I find him difficult to watch on videos. But this was the problem ..... he was talking economics and they were talking banking. Chalk-and-cheese!
    Quote:
  • An old army officer friend of mine is currently working within the annals of the EU and he spoke very highly of Yanis Varoufakis "He seriously knew his stuff economically speaking, but he couldn't play the game when he came to negotiate in Brussels. As a result he had to go because he became part of the negotiations problem so had to go". Basically forced out as he was upsetting the EU's political Union as they weren't focused on a financial one. Another elected politician that was forced out by the un-elected officials that haunt the EU.

Just like many intelligent people and very often, those in power, those he was negotiating with did not understand economics ..... they were Bankers and banking is fundamentally an accounting system. He saw a much broader picture than the IMF/ECB/EU team and you have to go right back to basics to realize why their approach to the Greek problem was so at odds.

Posted By: ProVox

Mouse:
    Quote:
  • Of course it was down to speculators, but the speculators at the time liked the idea of staying in the EU rather than leaving it.
    Do you agree with that statement.

Not really. I think you give these people too much credit for giving the subject a political consideration.
The result of the vote was their wake-up call ..... they had bet on the wrong horse and they needed to recoup their likely losses .......... and bringing the GBP down was the weapon they used.
But whatever way the vote went the GBP would have dropped in value against the Euro as it has been doing overall for some time previous to the referendum. When the referendum was announced the GBP went up in value but until then it was just the opposite. So, .... in my book it is speculators that make all the decisions that changed the value of the GBP ..... IMO : it will recover in time, if the UK negotiations get results. If they don’t we can blame it all on Teresa May and the Tories.
:roll:

Posted By: Woodrow Why?at

Pound, once again, well below 1.12 today :cry: ......who, with any grasp of reality, believes it would be this low if the outcome of the vote had been to 'remain'? :roll: (Notwithstanding that the 'leave' vote was, apparently, inconsequential!! :lol: :lol: )

Posted By: romatarot

Without going into too much detail, as I find this subject absolutely fascinating, I asked the question: 'What are the most important factors influencing currency exchange rates?'. It appears that there are 8 key factors: https://www.compareremit.com/money-transfer-guide/key-factors-affecting-currency-exchange-rates/ All of which operate simultaneously! As I, like many of my peers, feel most comfortable with stability, it stands to reason that any fluctuation in the status quo will upset the exchange rate apple cart. I believe we are being deliberately deceived in so many ways it would take many lifetimes to expose them all. I am always grateful to folk who recommend updating myself with current opinion such as Yiannis Varoufakis' work and books, it helps to stem the tide of panic that the 'news' often creates. I still hold dear the premise 'never a borrower or a lender be' quoted by my stepmother, Corrie. Of course that means compromises in the products that I choose to use/buy. Simplification and discernment in lifestyle choices usually helps, but some days are just too dark to contemplate and it feels like swimming against the current much of the time.

Posted By: FSB Properties

  • romatarot wrote:
    Without going into too much detail, as I find this subject absolutely fascinating, I asked the question: 'What are the most important factors influencing currency exchange rates?'.
    It appears that there are 8 key factors:
    https://www.compareremit.com/money-transfer-guide/key-factors-affecting-currency-exchange-rates/
    All of which operate simultaneously!
    As I, like many of my peers, feel most comfortable with stability, it stands to reason that any fluctuation in the status quo will upset the exchange rate apple cart.
    I believe we are being deliberately deceived in so many ways it would take many lifetimes to expose them all.
    I am always grateful to folk who recommend updating myself with current opinion such as Yiannis Varoufakis' work and books, it helps to stem the tide of panic that the 'news' often creates.
    I still hold dear the premise 'never a borrower or a lender be' quoted by my stepmother, Corrie. Of course that means compromises in the products that I choose to use/buy. Simplification and discernment in lifestyle choices usually helps, but some days are just too dark to contemplate and it feels like swimming against the current much of the time.

A very interesting link thanks for that, but I am a little confused.
I can understand how those factors may affect a single country say Sterling in the UK, but how do they lump together all the euro zone countries and apply those 8 factors, I mean each country has different characteristics. Just a thought.

Posted By: DAC

  • FSB Properties wrote:
    • romatarot wrote:
      Without going into too much detail, as I find this subject absolutely fascinating, I asked the question: 'What are the most important factors influencing currency exchange rates?'.
      It appears that there are 8 key factors:
      https://www.compareremit.com/money-transfer-guide/key-factors-affecting-currency-exchange-rates/
      All of which operate simultaneously!
      As I, like many of my peers, feel most comfortable with stability, it stands to reason that any fluctuation in the status quo will upset the exchange rate apple cart.
      I believe we are being deliberately deceived in so many ways it would take many lifetimes to expose them all.
      I am always grateful to folk who recommend updating myself with current opinion such as Yiannis Varoufakis' work and books, it helps to stem the tide of panic that the 'news' often creates.
      I still hold dear the premise 'never a borrower or a lender be' quoted by my stepmother, Corrie. Of course that means compromises in the products that I choose to use/buy. Simplification and discernment in lifestyle choices usually helps, but some days are just too dark to contemplate and it feels like swimming against the current much of the time.

    A very interesting link thanks for that, but I am a little confused.
    I can understand how those factors may affect a single country say Sterling in the UK, but how do they lump together all the euro zone countries and apply those 8 factors, I mean each country has different characteristics. Just a thought.

The Euro area is a Political Union and not a Economic One, so the worries of an unperforming country(s), Greece, Italy, Spain etc etc don't come into it as they're more focused on holding the Union together. If you're in any doubt then put your headphones on and invest 30 minutes of your life listening to this interview.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nGt82RFfg3U

Posted By: ProVox

Roma:
    Quote:
  • It appears that there are 8 key factors:
    https://www.compareremit.com/money-transfer-guide/key-factors-affecting-currency-exchange-rates/
    All of which operate simultaneously!

There are of course many other reasons, but the article was fair.
IMO: The first seven reasons can trigger the eighth, but they do not change the currency valuation directly. But any one of them or indeed all or none of them, could be the reason for the related action by speculators to buy or sell a currency and that will directly affect the exchange rate.
They are also interactive ( as Roma points out ), as one event that could invoke speculators actions to increase the value results in another event that triggers the reveres.
Reason 8 is on a different basis compared to the others as it is a direct action, the others are not, they are indirect and they all need the eighth to change the rate.
So, as I understand the article, 1 to 7 are the trigger that 8, The Speculators ( and computers ), respond to.
Speculators are the root cause of currency fluctuations! No speculators, no currency changes ..... like it used to be when the gold standard existed. I can remember walking through the City every evening in the late 60’s- early 70’s and the dollar/sterling rate in the window of a bank I passed every day, never changed ...... it was always USD 2.40 to GBP 1.0. Then the US scrapped the Gold Standard ( 1977 ?), the Petro Dollar became THE reserve currency and then currency speculation and investment banking, became an industry!
1)
2)
3)
4) = = = = = = > 8) Speculation 8 = direct buying/selling of currency.
5)
6)
7)

Posted By: ProVox

DAC:
A good video to watch that shows the other side of the story by someone directly involved. Both Varoufakis and Farage have been accused of being arrogant which I don’t agree with. They are both very well informed and I think both find it frustrating when dealing with those that lack even the basic knowledge of their respective areas of expertise.
I noticed quite near to the end he mentioned that Central Banks in the EU were not permitted to create money to bail individual States out of trouble. But they could do so through commercial banks ........... the reasons were interesting.
This article was published just before the referendum and the views expressed by Richard Werner reflect many of the points made by Varoufakis in the video interview. So, those that voted remain were not that dense after all! All that was needed was to look at the bigger picture and find out what remaining in the EU ultimately meant, especially in political terms.
    Quote:
  • EU Basics – Your Guide to the UK Referendum on EU Membership
    The British people should be clear about just what they will be voting on at the EU referendum this Thursday. What does it actually mean to stay in the EU? What does it mean to exit?
    Concerning the second question, the dominant issue in the debate has been the question whether there will be a significant negative economic impact on the UK from exiting the EU. Prime Minister David Cameron, together with the heads of the IMF, the OECD and various EU agencies have given dire warnings that economic growth will drop, the fiscal position will deteriorate, the currency will weaken and UK exports will decline precipitously. George Osborne, the chancellor of the exchequer has threatened to cut pensions if pensioners dare to vote for exit. But what are the facts?
    I have been trained in international and monetary economics at the London School of Economics and have a doctorate from the University of Oxford in economics. I have studied such issues for several decades. I have also recently tested, using advanced quantitative techniques, the question of the size of impact on GDP from entry to or exit from the EU or the Eurozone. The conclusion is that this makes no difference to economic growth, and everyone who claims the opposite is not guided by the facts. The reason is that economic growth and national income are almost entirely determined by a factor that is decided at home, namely the amount of bank credit created for productive purposes. This has sadly been very small in the UK in recent decades, thus much greater economic growth is possible as soon as steps are taken to boost bank credit for productive purposes – irrespective of whether the UK stays in the EU or not (although Brexit will make it much easier to take such policy steps). We should also remember that a much smaller economy like Norway – thought more dependent on international trade – fared extremely well after its people rejected EU membership in a referendum in 1995 (which happened against the dire warnings and threats from its cross-party elites, most of its media and the united chorus of the heads of international organisations). Besides, Japan, Korea, Taiwan and China never needed EU membership to move from developing economy status to top industrialised nations within about half a century. The argument of dire economic consequences of Brexit is bogus.

Complete paper:
https://professorwerner.wordpress.com/2016/06/21/eu-basics-your-guide-to-the-uk-referendum-on-eu-membership/

Posted By: ProVox

Food for thought? A better reason than ........ its all down to a dense population making the wrong choice through sheer ignorance?
    Quote:

  • Is THIS Why the British Pound Is Getting Decimated After Brexit? - by WashingtonsBlog
    The British economy has gone into the tank as part of the EU.
    Economics professor Richard Werner (the inventor of Quantitative Easing) has shown that Brexit will not hurt the British economy
    So why is the pound getting pummeled right now?
    Here’s a conspiracy theory …

    What if the central banks are shorting the pound, to send a message to the other countries thinking of leaving the EU that their economies will be beaten up if they leave?


    To be clear, this is just a hypothesis. I’m not saying that it’s true.


Posted By: Woodrow Why?at

  • ProVox wrote:

    So, those that voted remain were not that dense after all!

So glad you've finally concluded that those who voted REMAIN weren't at all 'dense' \:D/ (although I don't recall anybody ever suggesting we were! :? )

Posted By: ProVox

  • Woodrow Why?at wrote:
    • ProVox wrote:

      So, those that voted remain were not that dense after all!

    So glad you've finally concluded that those who voted REMAIN weren't at all 'dense' \:D/ (although I don't recall anybody ever suggesting we were! :? )

Thank you for taking the time to point out my error ...... you get a gold star for that! :oops: Of course I meant 'leave'. :wink:

Posted By: DAC

  • ProVox wrote:
    DAC:
    A good video to watch that shows the other side of the story by someone directly involved. Both Varoufakis and Farage have been accused of being arrogant which I don’t agree with. They are both very well informed and I think both find it frustrating when dealing with those that lack even the basic knowledge of their respective areas of expertise.
    I noticed quite near to the end he mentioned that Central Banks in the EU were not permitted to create money to bail individual States out of trouble. But they could do so through commercial banks ........... the reasons were interesting.
    This article was published just before the referendum and the views expressed by Richard Werner reflect many of the points made by Varoufakis in the video interview. So, those that voted remain were not that dense after all! All that was needed was to look at the bigger picture and find out what remaining in the EU ultimately meant, especially in political terms.
      Quote:
    • EU Basics – Your Guide to the UK Referendum on EU Membership
      The British people should be clear about just what they will be voting on at the EU referendum this Thursday. What does it actually mean to stay in the EU? What does it mean to exit?
      Concerning the second question, the dominant issue in the debate has been the question whether there will be a significant negative economic impact on the UK from exiting the EU. Prime Minister David Cameron, together with the heads of the IMF, the OECD and various EU agencies have given dire warnings that economic growth will drop, the fiscal position will deteriorate, the currency will weaken and UK exports will decline precipitously. George Osborne, the chancellor of the exchequer has threatened to cut pensions if pensioners dare to vote for exit. But what are the facts?
      I have been trained in international and monetary economics at the London School of Economics and have a doctorate from the University of Oxford in economics. I have studied such issues for several decades. I have also recently tested, using advanced quantitative techniques, the question of the size of impact on GDP from entry to or exit from the EU or the Eurozone. The conclusion is that this makes no difference to economic growth, and everyone who claims the opposite is not guided by the facts. The reason is that economic growth and national income are almost entirely determined by a factor that is decided at home, namely the amount of bank credit created for productive purposes. This has sadly been very small in the UK in recent decades, thus much greater economic growth is possible as soon as steps are taken to boost bank credit for productive purposes – irrespective of whether the UK stays in the EU or not (although Brexit will make it much easier to take such policy steps). We should also remember that a much smaller economy like Norway – thought more dependent on international trade – fared extremely well after its people rejected EU membership in a referendum in 1995 (which happened against the dire warnings and threats from its cross-party elites, most of its media and the united chorus of the heads of international organisations). Besides, Japan, Korea, Taiwan and China never needed EU membership to move from developing economy status to top industrialised nations within about half a century. The argument of dire economic consequences of Brexit is bogus.

    Complete paper:
    https://professorwerner.wordpress.com/2016/06/21/eu-basics-your-guide-to-the-uk-referendum-on-eu-membership/

My friend in Brussels also said that after BREXIT vote has happened that the European commission in Brussels are proposing that all EU members are to join the Eurozone by 2025. I suppose that they want to ensure that all the member states that don't use the Euro become fully trapped so that the Political Union can survive, although all will remain bankrupt until such time that it becomes an economic union and a stage closer to a Republic of Europe.

Posted By: Woodrow Why?at

  • ProVox wrote:
    • Woodrow Why?at wrote:
      • ProVox wrote:

        So, those that voted remain were not that dense after all!

      So glad you've finally concluded that those who voted REMAIN weren't at all 'dense' \:D/ (although I don't recall anybody ever suggesting we were! :? )

    Thank you for taking the time to point out my error ...... you get a gold star for that! :oops: Of course I meant 'leave'. :wink:

Yes, I can fully understand how, given the choice of two, you could easily confuse the words 'leave' and 'remain' (they do sound so similar, after all😊)
Although, I do fear that a slightly more harsh critic than myself might take the view that such an elementary mistake marks you down as a "simpleton"!! :lol:
I know I never would, not only because I could never be that rude <:-) but because I recognise that you are, indeed, a very intelligent person! :D
(Then again, as I have previously observed, and as you have subsequently shown, 'intelligence' should never be confused with 'common sense'!! 8)).

Posted By: badger

What is the world record for dogs chewing on a bleedin bone?

Posted By: Woodrow Why?at

  • badger wrote:
    What is the world record for dogs chewing on a bleedin bone?

Don't know.......but I expect you've got a photo of it!! :roll: :lol:

Posted By: romatarot

  • badger wrote:
    What is the world record for dogs chewing on a bleedin bone?

Probably depends on what bone it is :)
Tyrannosorus Rex might take a little less time than this lol.
DAC, I thoroughly enjoyed the interview on youtube with the swedish journalist and Y Varoufakis. It just underlines how common sense and economic sense are at odds with those who refuse to 'give up their seats'.

Posted By: Kwacka

  • DAC wrote:

    My friend in Brussels also said that after BREXIT vote has happened that the European commission in Brussels are proposing that all EU members are to join the Eurozone by 2025. I suppose that they want to ensure that all the member states that don't use the Euro become fully trapped so that the Political Union can survive, although all will remain bankrupt until such time that it becomes an economic union and a stage closer to a Republic of Europe.

If your friend in Brussels said it, it must be true!
Did he also tell you that any country not using the euro could veto the proposal, or that the EU parliament can reject it?
As we know, the Commission has no legislative powers, those are held by the elected MEPs and the Council of Ministers made up of ministers from each country.

Posted By: ProVox

  • Kwacka wrote:
    • DAC wrote:

      My friend in Brussels also said that after BREXIT vote has happened that the European commission in Brussels are proposing that all EU members are to join the Eurozone by 2025. I suppose that they want to ensure that all the member states that don't use the Euro become fully trapped so that the Political Union can survive, although all will remain bankrupt until such time that it becomes an economic union and a stage closer to a Republic of Europe.

    If your friend in Brussels said it, it must be true!
    Did he also tell you that any country not using the euro could veto the proposal, or that the EU parliament can reject it?
    As we know, the Commission has no legislative powers, those are held by the elected MEPs and the Council of Ministers made up of ministers from each country.

It appears there are only two countries that are not legally obliged to adopt the Euro, the UK and Denmark. This option apparently does not apply to the others ...... it’s all in the small print when they signed up.
With Brexit the EU is showing it can be very vindictive to nations that fail to comply with their wishes. So they could put the boot in if a country attempted to avoid adopting the Euro as their national currency. It is all part of the grand concept for ' ..... an ever closer Europe' i.e. The United States of Europe and that alone being a very sound reason for the UK to get out now!
So, I think that DAC’s friend is most probably correct. And the implementation does not need a vote.
    Quote:
  • Why These European Countries Don't Use the Euro
    There are currently 28 nations in the European Union and of these, nine countries are not in the Eurozone—the unified monetary system using the euro. Two of these countries, the United Kingdom and Denmark, are legally exempt from ever adopting the euro (the UK has voted to leave the EU, see Brexit). All other EU countries must enter the Eurozone after meeting certain criteria. Countries, however, do have the right to put off meeting the Eurozone criteria and thereby postpone their adoption of the euro.
    Read more: Why These European Countries Don't Use the Euro | Investopedia
    http://www.investopedia.com/articles/investing/050515/why-these-european-countries-dont-use-euro.asp#ixzz4newVwI5K


Posted By: DAC

  • Kwacka wrote:
    • DAC wrote:

      My friend in Brussels also said that after BREXIT vote has happened that the European commission in Brussels are proposing that all EU members are to join the Eurozone by 2025. I suppose that they want to ensure that all the member states that don't use the Euro become fully trapped so that the Political Union can survive, although all will remain bankrupt until such time that it becomes an economic union and a stage closer to a Republic of Europe.

    If your friend in Brussels said it, it must be true!
    Did he also tell you that any country not using the euro could veto the proposal, or that the EU parliament can reject it?
    As we know, the Commission has no legislative powers, those are held by the elected MEPs and the Council of Ministers made up of ministers from each country.

Given that it is the same friend who was one of Tony Blairs advisers on Europe, when Blair was PM, and who got me in to Downing Street and met both Blair and his wife, then I'd kind of put some strength behind it being true. But hey, what do I know.

Posted By: devil

  • DAC wrote:
    But hey, what do I know.

Not much! :)

Posted By: Woodrow Why?at

  • DAC wrote:
    • Kwacka wrote:
      • DAC wrote:

        My friend in Brussels also said that after BREXIT vote has happened that the European commission in Brussels are proposing that all EU members are to join the Eurozone by 2025. I suppose that they want to ensure that all the member states that don't use the Euro become fully trapped so that the Political Union can survive, although all will remain bankrupt until such time that it becomes an economic union and a stage closer to a Republic of Europe.

      If your friend in Brussels said it, it must be true!
      Did he also tell you that any country not using the euro could veto the proposal, or that the EU parliament can reject it?
      As we know, the Commission has no legislative powers, those are held by the elected MEPs and the Council of Ministers made up of ministers from each country.

    Given that it is the same friend who was one of Tony Blairs advisers on Europe, when Blair was PM, and who got me in to Downing Street and met both Blair and his wife, then I'd kind of put some strength behind it being true. But hey, what do I know.

Why did you - a right wing Tory - ever want to meet a Labour Prime Minister? (Other than to be able to boast about it later! :roll: ).
I know I would never have been interested in meeting the Mad Witch!! :evil:

Posted By: DAC

  • Woodrow Why?at wrote:
    • DAC wrote:
      • Kwacka wrote:
        • DAC wrote:

          My friend in Brussels also said that after BREXIT vote has happened that the European commission in Brussels are proposing that all EU members are to join the Eurozone by 2025. I suppose that they want to ensure that all the member states that don't use the Euro become fully trapped so that the Political Union can survive, although all will remain bankrupt until such time that it becomes an economic union and a stage closer to a Republic of Europe.

        If your friend in Brussels said it, it must be true!
        Did he also tell you that any country not using the euro could veto the proposal, or that the EU parliament can reject it?
        As we know, the Commission has no legislative powers, those are held by the elected MEPs and the Council of Ministers made up of ministers from each country.

      Given that it is the same friend who was one of Tony Blairs advisers on Europe, when Blair was PM, and who got me in to Downing Street and met both Blair and his wife, then I'd kind of put some strength behind it being true. But hey, what do I know.

    Why did you - a right wing Tory - ever want to meet a Labour Prime Minister? (Other than to be able to boast about it later! :roll: ).
    I know I would never have been interested in meeting the Mad Witch!! :evil:

There were three of us that went for a visit and tour of the inside of the building and it just happened to coincide with them being there. It was Christmas 2006 and it transpired that it was the day that local children were there for a Christmas party before turning on the lights with Cherie. We "accidentally" met Cherie on the way in as she was just going out to switch on the lights and 30 minutes later when we were leaving Blair was just leaving and he came to say hello.
It turns out that there's a 30-day protocol for entering No 10 Downing Street and from what I recall being told the only ones exempt are ministers. So basically, anyone that's in the building has been on a waiting list for 30 days so as such anyone that the PM should happen to "bump into" has a legitimate reason for being there. As you enter the door immediately on the left is a wooden set of pigeon holes for any mobile phones and the set of windows to the left of the main door is a waiting room.
Incidentally, WW, I never actually shook hands with Blair, just like I never did when I was forced to go and meet him whilst deployed overseas. The mans a narcissist who along with many of the other so-called-socialists is one of the biggest capitalists that there is.

Posted By: mouse

  • DAC wrote:
    • Woodrow Why?at wrote:
      • DAC wrote:
        • Kwacka wrote:
          • DAC wrote:

            My friend in Brussels also said that after BREXIT vote has happened that the European commission in Brussels are proposing that all EU members are to join the Eurozone by 2025. I suppose that they want to ensure that all the member states that don't use the Euro become fully trapped so that the Political Union can survive, although all will remain bankrupt until such time that it becomes an economic union and a stage closer to a Republic of Europe.

          If your friend in Brussels said it, it must be true!
          Did he also tell you that any country not using the euro could veto the proposal, or that the EU parliament can reject it?
          As we know, the Commission has no legislative powers, those are held by the elected MEPs and the Council of Ministers made up of ministers from each country.

        Given that it is the same friend who was one of Tony Blairs advisers on Europe, when Blair was PM, and who got me in to Downing Street and met both Blair and his wife, then I'd kind of put some strength behind it being true. But hey, what do I know.

      Why did you - a right wing Tory - ever want to meet a Labour Prime Minister? (Other than to be able to boast about it later! :roll: ).
      I know I would never have been interested in meeting the Mad Witch!! :evil:

    There were three of us that went for a visit and tour of the inside of the building and it just happened to coincide with them being there. It was Christmas 2006 and it transpired that it was the day that local children were there for a Christmas party before turning on the lights with Cherie. We "accidentally" met Cherie on the way in as she was just going out to switch on the lights and 30 minutes later when we were leaving Blair was just leaving and he came to say hello.
    It turns out that there's a 30-day protocol for entering No 10 Downing Street and from what I recall being told the only ones exempt are ministers. So basically, anyone that's in the building has been on a waiting list for 30 days so as such anyone that the PM should happen to "bump into" has a legitimate reason for being there. As you enter the door immediately on the left is a wooden set of pigeon holes for any mobile phones and the set of windows to the left of the main door is a waiting room.
    Incidentally, WW, I never actually shook hands with Blair, just like I never did when I was forced to go and meet him whilst deployed overseas. The mans a narcissist who along with many of the other so-called-socialists is one of the biggest capitalists that there is.

Does that mean he's a type of flower. :? :wink:

Posted By: mouse

  • Woodrow Why?at wrote:
    • DAC wrote:
      • Kwacka wrote:
        • DAC wrote:

          My friend in Brussels also said that after BREXIT vote has happened that the European commission in Brussels are proposing that all EU members are to join the Eurozone by 2025. I suppose that they want to ensure that all the member states that don't use the Euro become fully trapped so that the Political Union can survive, although all will remain bankrupt until such time that it becomes an economic union and a stage closer to a Republic of Europe.

        If your friend in Brussels said it, it must be true!
        Did he also tell you that any country not using the euro could veto the proposal, or that the EU parliament can reject it?
        As we know, the Commission has no legislative powers, those are held by the elected MEPs and the Council of Ministers made up of ministers from each country.

      Given that it is the same friend who was one of Tony Blairs advisers on Europe, when Blair was PM, and who got me in to Downing Street and met both Blair and his wife, then I'd kind of put some strength behind it being true. But hey, what do I know.

    Why did you - a right wing Tory - ever want to meet a Labour Prime Minister? (Other than to be able to boast about it later! :roll: ).
    I know I would never have been interested in meeting the Mad Witch!! :evil:

The only Politician of note I have met was John Profumo, who at the time was the Secretary of War. I was 9 years old at the time and our House (army quarters) in Episkopi was chosen as the venue for Photo's and Tea.
Iv'e got a photo somewhere of him with My Mum, Dad and my Bruvver and myself.
I think it was just before the time of the Profumo and Keeler affair became public knowledge.

Posted By: Kwacka

  • ProVox wrote:

    It appears there are only two countries that are not legally obliged to adopt the Euro, the UK and Denmark. This option apparently does not apply to the others ...... it’s all in the small print when they signed up.

It's not 'in the small print' it's well documented and publicised.
All countries that joined the EU after Maastrich are required to join the ERM and adopt the euro after two years of their currency being within the limits.
Sweden voted in a referendum not to adopt he euro, and hasn't. Romania and Bulgaria haven't remained withing the limits of the ERM.
As Yogi Berra once said "In theory there's no difference between theory and practice. In practice there is."
  • ProVox wrote:
    With Brexit the EU is showing it can be very vindictive to nations that fail to comply with their wishes. So they could put the boot in if a country attempted to avoid adopting the Euro as their national currency. It is all part of the grand concept for ' ..... an ever closer Europe' i.e. The United States of Europe and that alone being a very sound reason for the UK to get out now!

The United States of Europe? :lol:
The German government will vote to give more power to France?
The French Government will vote to give more power to Germany?
The Swedish people, in their referendum will give more power to the French OR German governments?
The Irish, in their referendum, will give France, Germany, Cyprus, Malta, Romania, & Bulgaria to have a say in their abortion laws?
As we know the EU Commission have NO legislative powers,
any proposal from the commission that suggests a change in the the treaties can be vetoed by national governments, and voted out by the EU parliament.
And why do you describe the EU as 'vindictive?

Posted By: Kwacka

  • Woodrow Why?at wrote:
    • DAC wrote:

      Given that it is the same friend who was one of Tony Blairs advisers on Europe, when Blair was PM, and who got me in to Downing Street and met both Blair and his wife, then I'd kind of put some strength behind it being true. But hey, what do I know.

    Why did you - a right wing Tory - ever want to meet a Labour Prime Minister? (Other than to be able to boast about it later! :roll: ).
    I know I would never have been interested in meeting the Mad Witch!! :evil:

DAC, a 'right wing Tory?
IIRC, DAC is a liberal - he told us so (although Mr T. expressed some surprise when he proclaimed this).

Posted By: Kwacka

  • DAC wrote:
    • Kwacka wrote:
      • Woodrow Why?at wrote:
        • DAC wrote:

          Given that it is the same friend who was one of Tony Blairs advisers on Europe, when Blair was PM, and who got me in to Downing Street and met both Blair and his wife, then I'd kind of put some strength behind it being true. But hey, what do I know.

        Why did you - a right wing Tory - ever want to meet a Labour Prime Minister? (Other than to be able to boast about it later! :roll: ).
        I know I would never have been interested in meeting the Mad Witch!! :evil:

      DAC, a 'right wing Tory?
      IIRC, DAC is a liberal - he told us so (although Mr T. expressed some surprise when he proclaimed this).

    TBH Kwacka I'm neither as at each election I'll choose to vote for the party that I believe has the best and most credible plan. However, those that stick with one party or another simply because they're Great Granddad, Granddad and Dad did or because "our town's a Tory/Labour/Liberal" town and always has been, are the ones with the least brain capacity as they obviously can't be trusted to think for themselves.

So you would still describe yourself as liberal?

Posted By: sugarray1955

  • devil wrote:
    • DAC wrote:
      But hey, what do I know.

    Not much! :)

Love it :D

Posted By: Kwacka

Afraid of how you might respond to an advance, PTH? :wink:

Posted By: DAC

  • sugarray1955 wrote:
    • devil wrote:
      • DAC wrote:
        But hey, what do I know.

      Not much! :)

    Love it :D

Coming from the person that asked me the same question 3 times, FX price fixing, as they never read my replies!!!

Posted By: bromerzz

Lets just get to parity and this thread can then be closed. 1:1 Oh dear.

Posted By: sugarray1955

  • DAC wrote:
    • sugarray1955 wrote:
      • devil wrote:
        • DAC wrote:
          But hey, what do I know.

        Not much! :)

      Love it :D

    Coming from the person that asked me the same question 3 times, FX price fixing, as they never read my replies!!!

Funny that, I only asked the question 2 times not 3 :roll: Instead of giving such a condescending convoluted answer why did you not just answer the question succinctly? A simple yes or no would have sufficed. Also what would happen if this unregulated company you advocate went bust after you had deposited your monthly payment, would your money be ring fenced in way?

Posted By: Woodrow Why?at

Pound now well below 1.11.......Oh Joy, let's all celebrate!! :roll:

Posted By: DAC

  • sugarray1955 wrote:
    • DAC wrote:
      • sugarray1955 wrote:
        • devil wrote:
          • DAC wrote:
            But hey, what do I know.

          Not much! :)

        Love it :D

      Coming from the person that asked me the same question 3 times, FX price fixing, as they never read my replies!!!

    Funny that, I only asked the question 2 times not 3 :roll: Instead of giving such a condescending convoluted answer why did you not just answer the question succinctly? A simple yes or no would have sufficed. Also what would happen if this unregulated company you advocate went bust after you had deposited your monthly payment, would your money be ring fenced in way?

NO and NO

Posted By: Dave B

Harold Wilson would have said "Brexit will not effect the pound in your pocket." Not to worry guys Mr Carney is probably paid in Euro?

Posted By: kanebill

The pound is higher against the dollar than it was one month ago. It is the Euro which has risen considerably in the last month. So according to all the moaning minnies Brexit has helped the Euro. It is the currency of your chosen residence so should you not rejoice? :lol: :lol: :lol:

Posted By: sugarray1955

  • kanebill wrote:
    The pound is higher against the dollar than it was one month ago. It is the Euro which has risen considerably in the last month. So according to all the moaning minnies Brexit has helped the Euro. It is the currency of your chosen residence so should you not rejoice? :lol: :lol: :lol:

?????????????????????????????????????????

Posted By: sugarray1955

  • DAC wrote:
    • sugarray1955 wrote:
      • DAC wrote:
        • sugarray1955 wrote:
          • devil wrote:
            • DAC wrote:
              But hey, what do I know.

            Not much! :)

          Love it :D

        Coming from the person that asked me the same question 3 times, FX price fixing, as they never read my replies!!!

      Funny that, I only asked the question 2 times not 3 :roll: Instead of giving such a condescending convoluted answer why did you not just answer the question succinctly? A simple yes or no would have sufficed. Also what would happen if this unregulated company you advocate went bust after you had deposited your monthly payment, would your money be ring fenced in way?

    NO and NO

Thank you, a succinct answer at last :)

Posted By: ProVox

  • sugarray1955 wrote:
    • kanebill wrote:
      The pound is higher against the dollar than it was one month ago. It is the Euro which has risen considerably in the last month. So according to all the moaning minnies Brexit has helped the Euro. It is the currency of your chosen residence so should you not rejoice? :lol: :lol: :lol:

    ?????????????????????????????????????????

The value of your primary asset ( an assumption ) has risen in value by as much as the pound has dropped. You are now ASSET richer than you were. :roll:

Posted By: DAC

  • kanebill wrote:
    The pound is higher against the dollar than it was one month ago. It is the Euro which has risen considerably in the last month. So according to all the moaning minnies Brexit has helped the Euro. It is the currency of your chosen residence so should you not rejoice? :lol: :lol: :lol:

HA HA HA not when your income is derived from Sterling, which is why they moan, and moan, and then moan some more.

Posted By: mouse

  • kanebill wrote:
    The pound is higher against the dollar than it was one month ago. It is the Euro which has risen considerably in the last month. So according to all the moaning minnies Brexit has helped the Euro. It is the currency of your chosen residence so should you not rejoice? :lol: :lol: :lol:

You cannot be serious? :roll:

Posted By: kanebill

  • mouse wrote:
    • kanebill wrote:
      The pound is higher against the dollar than it was one month ago. It is the Euro which has risen considerably in the last month. So according to all the moaning minnies Brexit has helped the Euro. It is the currency of your chosen residence so should you not rejoice? :lol: :lol: :lol:

    You cannot be serious? :roll:

Mouse, I think you should lie down or have a Keo. :)

Posted By: madmum

  • sugarray1955 wrote:
    • kanebill wrote:
      The pound is higher against the dollar than it was one month ago. It is the Euro which has risen considerably in the last month. So according to all the moaning minnies Brexit has helped the Euro. It is the currency of your chosen residence so should you not rejoice? :lol: :lol: :lol:

    ?????????????????????????????????????????

If this is correct then why has exchange rate here dropped to 1.09 from yesterday??? seems every time i drive past Nicks it has dropped even lower.

Posted By: mouse

  • madmum wrote:
    • sugarray1955 wrote:
      • kanebill wrote:
        The pound is higher against the dollar than it was one month ago. It is the Euro which has risen considerably in the last month. So according to all the moaning minnies Brexit has helped the Euro. It is the currency of your chosen residence so should you not rejoice? :lol: :lol: :lol:

      ?????????????????????????????????????????

    If this is correct then why has exchange rate here dropped to 1.09 from yesterday??? seems every time i drive past Nicks it has dropped even lower.

I think kanebill is using reverse logic.
I don't think he realises that most Brits receive their pensions in Sterling and that if the euro is doing well it is to the detriment of the pound.
And that it does not mean the euro is doing well, it is rather the pound is doing badly.

Posted By: kanebill

  • mouse wrote:
    • madmum wrote:
      • sugarray1955 wrote:
        • kanebill wrote:
          The pound is higher against the dollar than it was one month ago. It is the Euro which has risen considerably in the last month. So according to all the moaning minnies Brexit has helped the Euro. It is the currency of your chosen residence so should you not rejoice? :lol: :lol: :lol:

        ?????????????????????????????????????????

      If this is correct then why has exchange rate here dropped to 1.09 from yesterday??? seems every time i drive past Nicks it has dropped even lower.

    I think kanebill is using reverse logic.
    I don't think he realises that most Brits receive their pensions in Sterling and that if the euro is doing well it is to the detriment of the pound.
    And that it does not mean the euro is doing well, it is rather the pound is doing badly.

Oh dear, oh dear, oh dear! You should have had that Keo. I'll put the rod away.

Posted By: sugarray1955

  • DAC wrote:
    • kanebill wrote:
      The pound is higher against the dollar than it was one month ago. It is the Euro which has risen considerably in the last month. So according to all the moaning minnies Brexit has helped the Euro. It is the currency of your chosen residence so should you not rejoice? :lol: :lol: :lol:

    HA HA HA not when your income is derived from Sterling, which is why they moan, and moan, and then moan some more.

I have never moaned on here there is no point, it is swings and roundabouts with currency fluctuations, you just have to take the bad with the good. Fortunately for us my pension is a good one so we can quite easily take the knock/s when they happen. It is the people out here who are reliant on a state pension I feel for.

Posted By: DAC

  • sugarray1955 wrote:
    • DAC wrote:
      • kanebill wrote:
        The pound is higher against the dollar than it was one month ago. It is the Euro which has risen considerably in the last month. So according to all the moaning minnies Brexit has helped the Euro. It is the currency of your chosen residence so should you not rejoice? :lol: :lol: :lol:

      HA HA HA not when your income is derived from Sterling, which is why they moan, and moan, and then moan some more.

    I have never moaned on here there is no point, it is swings and roundabouts with currency fluctuations, you just have to take the bad with the good. Fortunately for us my pension is a good one so we can quite easily take the knock/s when they happen. It is the people out here who are reliant on a state pension I feel for.

If the Remoners are to be believed then that drop in GBP/EUR that is being felt by expats reliant upon a GBP income in Cyprus would be no better if you were based here in the UK as listening to the negative media everything here in the UK, that's imported, is also more expensive...

Posted By: Dave B

As I was told recently "I voted for Brexit because the Germans bombed our chippie" Now you can't argue with that that logic, but I tried .............and asked was it worth the inflation in the shops. The response was even more surprising as the Brexiteer said any amount of inflation or poverty was worth getting back at the Germans. This was an older person and for them WW2 did not end in 1945 - its still going on today.

Posted By: Mr Tibbs

  • Dave B wrote:
    As I was told recently "I voted for Brexit because the Germans bombed our chippie" Now you can't argue with that that logic, but I tried .............and asked was it worth the inflation in the shops. The response was even more surprising as the Brexiteer said any amount of inflation or poverty was worth getting back at the Germans.
    This was an older person and for them WW2 did not end in 1945 - its still going on today.

Perhaps you're just lucky. However, despite discussing Brexit widely, both here and in the U.K. (Who hasn't?) I've yet to hear anybody talking in those ridiculous terms.
Ever since 23/6/16 there's been a general tendency amongst petulantly disgruntled Remainers to portray leave voters in sneeringly derogatory terms. A bunch of red-neck, racist morons. All 17 million of them. It has probably as equally unfairly been claimed that a very large number of people, with little or no clue about the EU, voted sheepishly to remain merely for the status quo, or after being frightened into it. Stereotyping, on a grand scale.
The more vociferous Europhobic have often appeared to regard themselves as the bright, young and intelligent of the population. We know best (core EU philosophy).
It's just one of many factors and not to me by any means a principle one for voting to leave but if anybody has doubts about the extent of Germany's economic hegemony and policy-driving clout within the EU they should perhaps do a little research into the matter, before invoking laughable "blitz" era anecdotes. Your "village Brexit idiot" may actually be instinctively right I suggest.

Posted By: Woodrow Why?at

  • Mr Tibbs wrote:
    • Dave B wrote:
      As I was told recently "I voted for Brexit because the Germans bombed our chippie" Now you can't argue with that that logic, but I tried .............and asked was it worth the inflation in the shops. The response was even more surprising as the Brexiteer said any amount of inflation or poverty was worth getting back at the Germans.
      This was an older person and for them WW2 did not end in 1945 - its still going on today.

    Perhaps you're just lucky. However, despite discussing Brexit widely, both here and in the U.K. (Who hasn't?) I've yet to hear anybody talking in those ridiculous terms.
    It's just one of many factors and not to me by any means a principle one for voting to leave but if anybody has doubts about the extent of Germany's economic hegemony and policy-driving clout within the EU they should perhaps do a little research into the matter, before invoking laughable "blitz" era anecdotes. Your "village Brexit idiot" may actually be instinctively right I suggest.

So, you start off by talking of "those ridiculous terms" and finish by saying he "may actually be instinctively right"!! :?
Please excuse my confusion! :lol:

Posted By: ProVox

  • Woodrow Why?at wrote:
    • Mr Tibbs wrote:
      • Dave B wrote:
        As I was told recently "I voted for Brexit because the Germans bombed our chippie" Now you can't argue with that that logic, but I tried .............and asked was it worth the inflation in the shops. The response was even more surprising as the Brexiteer said any amount of inflation or poverty was worth getting back at the Germans.
        This was an older person and for them WW2 did not end in 1945 - its still going on today.

      Perhaps you're just lucky. However, despite discussing Brexit widely, both here and in the U.K. (Who hasn't?) I've yet to hear anybody talking in those ridiculous terms.
      It's just one of many factors and not to me by any means a principle one for voting to leave but if anybody has doubts about the extent of Germany's economic hegemony and policy-driving clout within the EU they should perhaps do a little research into the matter, before invoking laughable "blitz" era anecdotes. Your "village Brexit idiot" may actually be instinctively right I suggest.

    So, you start off by talking of "those ridiculous terms" and finish by saying he "may actually be instinctively right"!! :?
    Please excuse my confusion! :lol:

I'm not confused ..... he's right! BTW: The 'joke' about bombing our chippie I first heard from a scouser when working at Shell Stanlow ...... in 1974!!!! The old ones are the best. o :D :D

Posted By: Woodrow Why?at

  • ProVox wrote:
    • Woodrow Why?at wrote:
      • Mr Tibbs wrote:
        • Dave B wrote:
          As I was told recently "I voted for Brexit because the Germans bombed our chippie" Now you can't argue with that that logic, but I tried .............and asked was it worth the inflation in the shops. The response was even more surprising as the Brexiteer said any amount of inflation or poverty was worth getting back at the Germans.
          This was an older person and for them WW2 did not end in 1945 - its still going on today.

        Perhaps you're just lucky. However, despite discussing Brexit widely, both here and in the U.K. (Who hasn't?) I've yet to hear anybody talking in those ridiculous terms.
        It's just one of many factors and not to me by any means a principle one for voting to leave but if anybody has doubts about the extent of Germany's economic hegemony and policy-driving clout within the EU they should perhaps do a little research into the matter, before invoking laughable "blitz" era anecdotes. Your "village Brexit idiot" may actually be instinctively right I suggest.

      So, you start off by talking of "those ridiculous terms" and finish by saying he "may actually be instinctively right"!! :?
      Please excuse my confusion! :lol:

    I'm not confused ..... he's right!

Well PV, may I say that your assertion that somebody who speaks in 'ridiculous terms' is 'right' doesn't surprise me at all!! :lol: :lol:

Posted By: Kwacka

IIRC , the 'Germans bombed our chippie' was rolled out on the ancient "The Comedians" TV show.

Posted By: ProVox

  • Woodrow Why?at wrote:
    • ProVox wrote:
      • Woodrow Why?at wrote:
        • Mr Tibbs wrote:
          • Dave B wrote:
            As I was told recently "I voted for Brexit because the Germans bombed our chippie" Now you can't argue with that that logic, but I tried .............and asked was it worth the inflation in the shops. The response was even more surprising as the Brexiteer said any amount of inflation or poverty was worth getting back at the Germans.
            This was an older person and for them WW2 did not end in 1945 - its still going on today.

          Perhaps you're just lucky. However, despite discussing Brexit widely, both here and in the U.K. (Who hasn't?) I've yet to hear anybody talking in those ridiculous terms.
          It's just one of many factors and not to me by any means a principle one for voting to leave but if anybody has doubts about the extent of Germany's economic hegemony and policy-driving clout within the EU they should perhaps do a little research into the matter, before invoking laughable "blitz" era anecdotes. Your "village Brexit idiot" may actually be instinctively right I suggest.

        So, you start off by talking of "those ridiculous terms" and finish by saying he "may actually be instinctively right"!! :?
        Please excuse my confusion! :lol:

      I'm not confused ..... he's right!

    Well PV, may I say that your assertion that somebody who speaks in 'ridiculous terms' is 'right' doesn't surprise me at all!! :lol: :lol:

Now read it again! TIBBS said he had never come across any one who 'spoke in such ridiculous terms' ....... but those that you regard as demented idiots and mental retards ..........may just turn out to be 'instinctively right' .
I happen to agree with him but you need to be able to take a broader view than you do. :D :D

Posted By: Woodrow Why?at

  • ProVox wrote:
    • Woodrow Why?at wrote:
      • ProVox wrote:
        • Woodrow Why?at wrote:
          • Mr Tibbs wrote:
            • Dave B wrote:
              As I was told recently "I voted for Brexit because the Germans bombed our chippie" Now you can't argue with that that logic, but I tried .............and asked was it worth the inflation in the shops. The response was even more surprising as the Brexiteer said any amount of inflation or poverty was worth getting back at the Germans.
              This was an older person and for them WW2 did not end in 1945 - its still going on today.

            Perhaps you're just lucky. However, despite discussing Brexit widely, both here and in the U.K. (Who hasn't?) I've yet to hear anybody talking in those ridiculous terms.
            It's just one of many factors and not to me by any means a principle one for voting to leave but if anybody has doubts about the extent of Germany's economic hegemony and policy-driving clout within the EU they should perhaps do a little research into the matter, before invoking laughable "blitz" era anecdotes. Your "village Brexit idiot" may actually be instinctively right I suggest.

          So, you start off by talking of "those ridiculous terms" and finish by saying he "may actually be instinctively right"!! :?
          Please excuse my confusion! :lol:

        I'm not confused ..... he's right!

      Well PV, may I say that your assertion that somebody who speaks in 'ridiculous terms' is 'right' doesn't surprise me at all!! :lol: :lol:

    Now read it again! TIBBS said he had never come across any one who 'spoke in such ridiculous terms' ....... but those that you regard as demented idiots and mental retards ..........may just turn out to be 'instinctively right' .
    I happen to agree with him but you need to be able to take a broader view than you do. :D :D

I think we all need to take a VERY broad view to understand somebody who so easily confuses 'leave' with 'remain'!! :wink: :lol:

Posted By: Woodrow Why?at

  • Kwacka wrote:
    IIRC , the 'Germans bombed our chippie' was rolled out on the ancient "The Comedians" TV show.

I believe that was the Liverpool comedian, Stan Boardman, who incidentally, also caused uproar when, on the Des O'Connor show, he told a joke about the German 'Fockers'! (It was a play on words about their fighter plane, the Focke Wolfe!) 8)

Posted By: Kwacka

  • Woodrow Why?at wrote:
    • Kwacka wrote:
      IIRC , the 'Germans bombed our chippie' was rolled out on the ancient "The Comedians" TV show.

    I believe that was the Liverpool comedian, Stan Boardman, who incidentally, also caused uproar when, on the Des O'Connor show, he told a joke about the German 'Fockers'! (It was a play on words about their fighter plane, the Focke Wolfe!) 8)

Stan Boardman - a 'comedian'? :shock:

Posted By: Mr Tibbs

  • Kwacka wrote:
    • Woodrow Why?at wrote:
      • Kwacka wrote:
        IIRC , the 'Germans bombed our chippie' was rolled out on the ancient "The Comedians" TV show.

      I believe that was the Liverpool comedian, Stan Boardman, who incidentally, also caused uproar when, on the Des O'Connor show, he told a joke about the German 'Fockers'! (It was a play on words about their fighter plane, the Focke Wolfe!) 8)

    Stan Boardman - a 'comedian'? :shock:

And if IRCC not too original.
I've got a vague recollection of Harry H Corbett, in a comedy film way back, being chased across the lawns of a stately home by a WW1 plane whilst shouting "It's a Focker!" :D

Posted By: Woodrow Why?at

  • Kwacka wrote:
    • Woodrow Why?at wrote:
      • Kwacka wrote:
        IIRC , the 'Germans bombed our chippie' was rolled out on the ancient "The Comedians" TV show.

      I believe that was the Liverpool comedian, Stan Boardman, who incidentally, also caused uproar when, on the Des O'Connor show, he told a joke about the German 'Fockers'! (It was a play on words about their fighter plane, the Focke Wolfe!) 8)

    Stan Boardman - a 'comedian'? :shock:

I'll concede that he's not as much of a comedian as those on here who insist the fall in the value of Sterling had nothing to do with the Referendum result!! :wink: :lol: :lol:

Posted By: sugarray1955

  • ProVox wrote:
    • Woodrow Why?at wrote:
      • Mr Tibbs wrote:
        • Dave B wrote:
          As I was told recently "I voted for Brexit because the Germans bombed our chippie" Now you can't argue with that that logic, but I tried .............and asked was it worth the inflation in the shops. The response was even more surprising as the Brexiteer said any amount of inflation or poverty was worth getting back at the Germans.
          This was an older person and for them WW2 did not end in 1945 - its still going on today.

        Perhaps you're just lucky. However, despite discussing Brexit widely, both here and in the U.K. (Who hasn't?) I've yet to hear anybody talking in those ridiculous terms.
        It's just one of many factors and not to me by any means a principle one for voting to leave but if anybody has doubts about the extent of Germany's economic hegemony and policy-driving clout within the EU they should perhaps do a little research into the matter, before invoking laughable "blitz" era anecdotes. Your "village Brexit idiot" may actually be instinctively right I suggest.

      So, you start off by talking of "those ridiculous terms" and finish by saying he "may actually be instinctively right"!! :?
      Please excuse my confusion! :lol:

    I'm not confused ..... he's right! BTW: The 'joke' about bombing our chippie I first heard from a scouser when working at Shell Stanlow ...... in 1974!!!! The old ones are the best. o :D :D

If you were there in 74 I was not too far away from you, just across the water at ICI Castner Kellner works :)

Posted By: ProVox

Sugarray:
    Quote:
  • If you were there in 74 I was not too far away from you, just across the water at ICI Castner Kellner works


I remember the ICI plant on the hill with the two chorine spheres, but never went there.

I was located on the Stanlow complex but at a company that was located adjacent to the motorway ..... Cabot Carbon ..... the soot makers.

The engineering office later moved from there to Port Sunlight in ’85 and later, after I left the dept. became no longer viable when tyres started coming in from China and the requirement for carbon black dropped off. I later learned that the US management of the plant announced the plant was closing ...... virtually with one weeks notice. All the proprietary equipment was recovered by people bought over from the US ...... and shipped to China. The plant was then levelled.
Small world init? :wink: :)

Posted By: Woodrow Why?at

Slightly off topic, but didn't want to upset anyone by starting another thread on the subject!!:wink: http://www.thepoke.co.uk/2016/09/07/letter-private-eye-nails-brexit-worth-read/#.WYs9AKKUJvc.email (Just to clarify, for the benefit of any 'simpletons' out there, that this is another analogy and I am perfectly aware that no aircraft were involved in the making of 'Brexit'!! :lol: :lol: )

Posted By: Mr Tibbs

No Woody! You should start a new thread: "Pound hits €1.10!" Go for it! :wink:

Posted By: Woodrow Why?at

  • Mr Tibbs wrote:
    No Woody! You should start a new thread:
    "Pound hits €1.10!"
    Go for it! :wink:

As this thread is approaching some 5000 views, I think my point has been made, and any further update might be considered as somewhat superfluous! 8)

Posted By: Mr Tibbs

  • Woodrow Why?at wrote:
    • Mr Tibbs wrote:
      No Woody! You should start a new thread:
      "Pound hits €1.10!"
      Go for it! :wink:

    As this thread is approaching some 5000 views, I think my point has been made, and any further update might be considered as somewhat superfluous! 8)

But 4000 are yours Woody. :P
The rest are looking to see what you do next. :wink:

Posted By: Kwacka

Why is the pound so low against the euro?
http://www.bbc.com/news/business-40896987

Posted By: emanon

Woodrow, I do like the post re May being a pilot. but she would already have left the flight and be sitting in a lifeboat in order to save her own skin. Needless to say the boat would be rudderless, with no one capable of taking control, and with no one capable of giving directions, heading straight for the rocks! Back to the topic regarding the value of the pound. All sorts of things come into the equation, and as someone pointed out is it the weakness of the pound or the strength of the euro? Interest rates have a huge impact, and the BOE has signalled no interest rate rises are likely for a while. Then there are the gamblers who can manipulate markets. Other countries policies can also affect the exchange rate/ If only we had a crystal ball! :?

Posted By: Kwacka

From the link "The first thing to say is that it is primarily about euro strength rather than pound weakness." Which then goes on to list the reasons for the strengthening of the euro, e.g. expected ECB reduction of QE this year.

Posted By: ProVox

  • Kwacka wrote:
    Why is the pound so low against the euro?
    http://www.bbc.com/news/business-40896987

With a little more respect for your link than normally any of my links would receive from you:
The BBC is a right wing government funded organisation that projects UK Government policies. It is unashamedly anti-Russia/Iranian/Chinese and overtly promotes US/NATO policy and propaganda.
The article by Karen Hoggan is middle of the road and with no particular bias. However Simon Derek is misrepresented as a ' strategist but he is a part of the money market speculation circus and is thus part of the banking system. His strategy is based on guess work not facts.
Fundamentally he is a currency speculator for Bank of New York Mellon who are one of the major investment banks based in the US. So he is heavily biased with his views and opinions toward the currency system.

Posted By: ProVox

  • Woodrow Why?at wrote:
    • Kwacka wrote:
      • Woodrow Why?at wrote:
        • Kwacka wrote:
          IIRC , the 'Germans bombed our chippie' was rolled out on the ancient "The Comedians" TV show.

        I believe that was the Liverpool comedian, Stan Boardman, who incidentally, also caused uproar when, on the Des O'Connor show, he told a joke about the German 'Fockers'! (It was a play on words about their fighter plane, the Focke Wolfe!) 8)

      Stan Boardman - a 'comedian'? :shock:

    I'll concede that he's not as much of a comedian as those on here who insist the fall in the value of Sterling had nothing to do with the Referendum result!! :wink: :lol: :lol:

The difference between your view and mine is that I can prove my view with hard evidence ............ and you can't.
I can demonstrate exactly why it happened and how it was achieved. That is, I can identify the problem and having done that it is relatively easy to come up with a solution.
If you want to prove me wrong .... explain how you come to your firmly held belief that the fall in value of the £ since the referendum was all due to the result of that vote? Put your reputation where your mouth is! :wink:

Posted By: ProVox

Emanon
    Quote:
  • Back to the topic regarding the value of the pound. All sorts of things come into the equation, and as someone pointed out is it the weakness of the pound or the strength of the euro? Interest rates have a huge impact, and the BOE has signalled no interest rate rises are likely for a while. Then there are the gamblers who can manipulate markets. Other countries policies can also affect the exchange rate/
    If only we had a crystal ball!

Interst rates have a huge impact? Are you sure of that after all they have been just about flat lining for some years now, both in UK/Europe and the US?
If the BoE has ‘ signalled ’ that nothing is likely to change ..... how does this have ‘ huge impact ’ ....... nothing changes?
Other countries policies affect the exchange rate? Maybe over the long term ...... but not in the short term.
Then there are the gamblers who can manipulate the markets. Well on that we will agree, except they are referred to as currency/market speculators and work for the Banks. The whole purpose of any ‘ market ’ is to manipulate perceived values of commodities for profit.
All market are primarily driven by supply and demand. I don’t think anyone would argue with that? But the currency market is unique in that it provides both supply and demand simultaneously and for a commodity created by its parent organisation.
You missed an important influence on the long term valuation of sterling, or any other currency, and that is the money supply. This is 98% provided by commercial Banks and this is what causes inflation. But the effect is over time, whereas short term currency changes are created only by speculators. Woody, however would have you believe it is all down to the result of the referendum and you have missed this off your list!
If only we had a crystal ball?...... if only we had the ‘balls’ to confront the problem!
:roll: :wink:

Posted By: Mr Tibbs

Here's what I found to be a fascinating account of the power of currency speculation. The story of how Hedge funds and speculators can (and did) force the devaluation of currencies to make massive profits and in particular how George Soros made a billion dollars from it. "Britain was presiding over a vast financial transfer from its long-suffering taxpayers to a global army of traders". https://www.theatlantic.com/business/archive/2010/06/go-for-the-jugular/57696/ There's nothing new under the sun.

Posted By: ProVox

  • Mr Tibbs wrote:
    Here's what I found to be a fascinating account of the power of currency speculation.
    The story of how Hedge funds and speculators can (and did) force the devaluation of currencies to make massive profits and in particular how George Soros made a billion dollars from it.
    "Britain was presiding over a vast financial transfer from its long-suffering taxpayers to a global army of traders".
    https://www.theatlantic.com/business/archive/2010/06/go-for-the-jugular/57696/
    There's nothing new under the sun.

Yes an interesting account of events! At that time I was working for a German company and was paid in DM, it was like a massive pay rise for us.
Now imagine the same scenario today. China and Russia hold massive amounts of US debt ...... imagine the effect if they emulated this sort of attack on the US currency. I wonder .... would the FED just react by doing very little whist their economy and currency went down the drain?

Posted By: Mr Tibbs

  • ProVox wrote:
    Now imagine the same scenario today. China and Russia hold massive amounts of US debt ...... imagine the effect if they emulated this sort of attack on the US currency. I wonder .... would the FED just react by doing very little whist their economy and currency went down the drain?

A different kettle of fish I suspect, when you have control of the World's dominant reserve currency and its strongest economy.
However, wrt the £/€ a bit of a different story?

Posted By: Mr Tibbs

  • ProVox wrote:
    The BBC is a right wing government funded organisation that projects UK Government policies. It is unashamedly anti-Russia/Iranian/Chinese and overtly promotes US/NATO policy and propaganda.

I've heard Auntie described in many terms but that's a first. :lol:
Are we talking about the same organisation?
The one with a common perception of its being stuffed full of "Institutionally left wing" Guardianistas?

The organisation which is currently reporting the NK situation as a rerun of the Cuban Missile Crisis, with Trump as the villain?
The one that's currently being taken to task over its censoring of news highly inconvenient to its pro-EU narrative? The DG has acquired the title of Lord Hall Hall. :lol: If you look you can find examples of this particular aspect of Beeb spin.
How about it's past strongly pro-Palestinian/anti-Israel news?
There's lots of this stuff but I think few would argue with the fact that the BBC has been a real pain in the butt to any HMG representative that doesn't reflect its agenda. I suspect Kwacka might disagree. :lol:
Forgive the DE. I'm off out and it just came top of the list:
http://www.express.co.uk/news/politics/814086/BBC-bias-Theresa-May-general-election-coverage-Mishal-Husain
All this hardly adds up to the likes of a real State mouthpiece - like RT/Sputnik.
Hall, I'm sure, doesn't feel any personal concern about criticising Theresa May and her colleagues, or Jeremy. That is, he's unlikely to be found with a hole in the head near Parliament, the supposed convenient victim of the likes of disgruntled Scottish separatists.
Or do you regard RT/S and other such mouthpieces for dictatorships as impartial fonts of free speech and organisations fiercely intent upon bringing their nation's public servants into the fire of democratic accountability? :wink:

Posted By: ProVox

TIBBS:
Or do you regard RT/S and other such mouthpieces for dictatorships as impartial fonts of free speech and organisations fiercely intent upon bringing their nation's public servants into the fire of democratic accountability? Wink
I would reply in detail but it is way off the thread! :roll:

Posted By: Mr Tibbs

  • ProVox wrote:
    TIBBS:
    Or do you regard RT/S and other such mouthpieces for dictatorships as impartial fonts of free speech and organisations fiercely intent upon bringing their nation's public servants into the fire of democratic accountability? Wink
    I would reply in detail but it is way off the thread! :roll:

Not really. We'll sort of. I'm by no means a supporter but you described the BBC in a pretty draconian manner. Moreover, one which I suspect you would find little support for hereabouts. It;s reasonable to respond to that. Although once again it's a case of "no reply"?
Conversely, you've often presented articles from the likes of RT as being authoritative and entirely trustworthy. I'm sure most can spot the inherent contradiction.

Posted By: Kwacka

  • ProVox wrote:
    The BBC is a right wing government funded organisation that projects UK Government policies. It is unashamedly anti-Russia/Iranian/Chinese and overtly promotes US/NATO policy and propaganda.

:lol:
Criticised by the right, slated by the left, I wonder what that means?
Although there is some evidence from your claim.
Chairman of BBC, ex-Tory Minister Sir Chris Patten
Nick Robinson, former chairman of Young Conservatives - Political editor
Thea Rogers (former senior political producer under Robinson) George Osborne's special advisor.
Andrew Neil - chairman of The Spectator
Robbie Gibb, Neil's editor - former chief of staff to Francis Maude
Kamal Ahmed, business editor, was Sunday Telegraph journalist.
Craig Oliver, BBC news controller, David Cameron's communications director.
Gutto harri - Boris Johnon's communications director.
(Some of these are (recent) historical positions).
How much have you heard on the BBC about the privatisation of the NHS (e.g. Virgin Care) - reports published in the Daily Mail (yes, really) about Ministerial connections to the private health industry, but 120 words (of which 50% were a rebuttal) from the BBC?
How much have you heard from the BBC about, for example, economic policies other that 'austerity, austerit, austerity'?
    Quote:
  • Rethinking the BBC: Public Media in the 21st Century brings together some of the most influential and creative thinkers on media politics and policy in the UK and beyond. It is a vital contribution to the debate on public media at a moment of rapid change.

Rethinking the BBC: Public Media in the 21st Century (free to download/read online)
    Quote:
  • “The content analysis demonstrates that there is an especially high number of political figures providing statistical information on BBC [output],” said the report. “And Conservative politicians represented nearly three-quarters (73%) of these statistical references.”

    Quote:
  • “BBC journalists need the confidence and skills to go beyond headlines, and to challenge misleading claims.”

    Quote:
  • “It is reasonable to expect the BBC to cover statements which the UK or devolved governments make. […] However, as Cardiff’s content analysis points out, it does make it vital that those statements are challenged where necessary so that the impartiality of the BBC’s coverage of political affairs is not affected.”

http://downloads.bbc.co.uk/bbctrust/assets/files/pdf/our_work/stats_impartiality/report.pdf
  • Mt Tibbs wrote:
    Here's what I found to be a fascinating account of the power of currency speculation.
    The story of how Hedge funds and speculators can (and did) force the devaluation of currencies to make massive profits and in particular how George Soros made a billion dollars from it.
    "Britain was presiding over a vast financial transfer from its long-suffering taxpayers to a global army of traders".
    https://www.theatlantic.com/business/archive/2010/06/go-for-the-jugular/57696/

Reading the article you cite it appears that financiers took advantage of (rather than caused) the British government's errors - in particular it's entry into the ERM at an unsustainable level.
Surely Soros is to be praised for doing 'a good bit of business'?

Posted By: Mr Tibbs

  • Kwacka wrote:
    • ProVox wrote:
      The BBC is a right wing government funded organisation that projects UK Government policies. It is unashamedly anti-Russia/Iranian/Chinese and overtly promotes US/NATO policy and propaganda.

    :lol:
    Criticised by the right, slated by the left, I wonder what that means?

I gave a few examples of what I regard as a tendency to dress to the left by the BBC. Whilst it isn't a matter of policy - as racism apparently wasn't in the Met - I believe that it's nevertheless a demonstrable reality.
The "left" talks in terms which I submit make the good ole Beeb look more like a North Korean TV outfit. As much as I've a modicum of contempt for Auntie I don't recognise her from the opening para. Does anyone? The evidence which contradicts that view is overwhelming.
Nevertheless, as I'm sure will have been highlighted earlier, Morgan Stanley at least are talking in terms of £/€ parity by the year's end.
In which case the expat pips will obviously be squeekin' and Woody will be insufferable. All those lost bottles of Cabernet Sauvignon! :(

Posted By: ProVox

  • Mr Tibbs wrote:
    • ProVox wrote:
      TIBBS:
      Or do you regard RT/S and other such mouthpieces for dictatorships as impartial fonts of free speech and organisations fiercely intent upon bringing their nation's public servants into the fire of democratic accountability? Wink
      I would reply in detail but it is way off the thread! :roll:

    Not really. We'll sort of. I'm by no means a supporter but you described the BBC in a pretty draconian ( Really??? I thought it was rather restrained ) manner. Moreover, one which I suspect you would find little support for hereabouts. It;s reasonable to respond to that.
    Although once again it's a case of "no reply"?
    Conversely, you've often presented articles from the likes of RT as being authoritative and entirely trustworthy. I'm sure most can spot the inherent contradiction.

Please don't take a ‘ no reply’ as and indication that I don’t have one. I have learned through bitter experiences with you that your posts are often ' loaded ' to invoke a confrontation and intended to put me on the defence. I do it to avoid a conflict which inevitably you will make personal.
As you are a hair's breadth away from doing here.
But as my reading and watching habits seem to captivate you:
I gave up watching BBC shortly after the gassing incident in Ghouta.
Within days, when the hard evidence started to emerge from the site itself and a myriad of professional observations of the incident started to emerge, the picture painted was vastly different to that expressed at the time by the BBC and, as far as I know, they have never retracted it to this day. I was already impressed with Putins diplomatic and military prowess from the way he handled the Crimea situation, which stands in sharp contrast to the way the west deals with similar situations. His diplomatic handling of this incident was a masterpiece and avoided yet another US inspired war. Since then of course there has been the Aleppo disinformation propaganda and other so called ’Assad gasses own people’ incidents which have all turned out later to be misinformation provided almost exclusively by insurgent terrorist organisations that the western coalition arms and supports.
I never watch CNN! I now watch SKY News and RT on a 50:50 basis. I find neither to be in any way as biased and misrepresentative of facts as the BBC. I also enjoy watching the various political discussions and interviews on RT which are virtually non-existent on SKY and horribly loaded on BBC. e,g, Steven Zakur’s “ ... do you honestly expect me to believe (whatever) .....” or Katie Kays “ Really??? when the reply is not to her liking
I read the on-line Daily Mail every day and sometimes the Guardian, Independent etc. I also read the Cyprus mail. In addition I get e-mails every day from various independent news/opinion sources. These sources are of course an anathema to you as they tend, for very obvious reasons, mainly to be left leaning, although not exclusively. But many of the authors are well known independents, use multiple links to support their statement whether it is an opinion or a fact, and have been journalists/investigative journalists for decade's.

That’s it!

Posted By: Kwacka

  • Mr Tibbs wrote:

    Nevertheless, as I'm sure will have been highlighted earlier, Morgan Stanley at least are talking in terms of £/€ parity by the year's end.

And that's BEFORE the UK leaves the EU. :shock:
just think what it would be like if the euro wasn't a failing currency.

Posted By: Mr Tibbs

  • ProVox wrote:
    Please don't take a ‘ no reply’ as and indication that I don’t have one. I have learned through bitter experiences with you that your posts are often ' loaded ' to invoke a confrontation and intended to put me on the defence. I do it to avoid a conflict which inevitably you will make personal.

Well, as far as no reply is concerned I've made many relevant points on the NK thread in Debate, all of which I regard as entirely valid and difficult to answer, with a rational, sensible and serious response that is. However, they've absolutely all been swept aside with a dismissive "I won't answer that, because it's abusive" reply. IMHO that's just a case of evasion. So be it. I consider the points made and hit-home though.
I find it difficult to believe you can't see how provocative some of your posts can be. As with this one, regarding the Beeb.
  • ProVox wrote:
    The BBC is a right wing government funded organisation that projects UK Government policies. It is unashamedly anti-Russia/Iranian/Chinese and overtly promotes US/NATO policy and propaganda.

Don't you think your "loaded" and "confrontation" comments above are a tad hypocritical?
I've demonstrated on many occasions my contempt for the BBC's so called neutrality but you're painting it as a slavish mouthpiece for the UK government and Western policies is clearly absurd. Citizen Smith stuff. Fantasy. It cries out for some sort of response. What on earth did you expect? Acceptance? :roll:
You then shoot off to Syria and even the Crimea with your perception of things there which, as is always the case, is a clear parroting of the Moscow line. Now, addressing that really would be off-thread. There's also a bit of the usual Putin worship thrown in.
You do avoid the fact that Russia is not a liberal democracy Here's a bit of freebie news - it's a dictatorship. State media in Russia is not some sort of truth Nirvana. It's tightly controlled in a way that puts your ridiculous comments about the BBC in perspective.
I agree that western media, particularly in the US, can be anarchic. However, in Russia the media are a mouthpiece for its dictator. You could argue that there's far too much diversity of media opinion in the West but in contrast there's absolutely no free press in Russia.
You need to get real about the likes of the BBC, before shoving Moscow "news" down people's throats, presenting it as the truth.

Posted By: mouse

  • ProVox wrote:
    • Kwacka wrote:
      Why is the pound so low against the euro?
      http://www.bbc.com/news/business-40896987

    With a little more respect for your link than normally any of my links would receive from you:
    The BBC is a right wing government funded organisation that projects UK Government policies. It is unashamedly anti-Russia/Iranian/Chinese and overtly promotes US/NATO policy and propaganda.
    The article by Karen Hoggan is middle of the road and with no particular bias. However Simon Derek is misrepresented as a ' strategist but he is a part of the money market speculation circus and is thus part of the banking system. His strategy is based on guess work not facts.
    Fundamentally he is a currency speculator for Bank of New York Mellon who are one of the major investment banks based in the US. So he is heavily biased with his views and opinions toward the currency system.

It's funny that though, if you go back over recent times on the forum according to the Right wing fraternity on here the BBC are a Left wing organisation.
Obviously not Right wing enough. :wink:

Posted By: Mr Tibbs

  • mouse wrote:
    It's funny that though, if you go back over recent times on the forum according to the Right wing fraternity on here the BBC are a Left wing organisation.
    Obviously not Right wing enough. :wink:

Well, neutral would be nice I think. Isn't that in the Charter? Which also incidentally details the organisation's editorial independence.
Of course, Left wingers would say it was balanced. Everything's like that when it's balanced in your direction.

Posted By: mouse

  • Mr Tibbs wrote:
    • mouse wrote:
      It's funny that though, if you go back over recent times on the forum according to the Right wing fraternity on here the BBC are a Left wing organisation.
      Obviously not Right wing enough. :wink:

    Well, neutral would be nice I think. Isn't that in the Charter? Which also incidentally details the organisation's editorial independence.
    Of course, Left wingers would say it was balanced. Everything's like that when it's balanced in your direction.

And Right wingers?

Posted By: Woodrow Why?at

  • ProVox wrote:
    • Woodrow Why?at wrote:
      • Kwacka wrote:
        • Woodrow Why?at wrote:
          • Kwacka wrote:
            IIRC , the 'Germans bombed our chippie' was rolled out on the ancient "The Comedians" TV show.

          I believe that was the Liverpool comedian, Stan Boardman, who incidentally, also caused uproar when, on the Des O'Connor show, he told a joke about the German 'Fockers'! (It was a play on words about their fighter plane, the Focke Wolfe!) 8)

        Stan Boardman - a 'comedian'? :shock:

      I'll concede that he's not as much of a comedian as those on here who insist the fall in the value of Sterling had nothing to do with the Referendum result!! :wink: :lol: :lol:

    The difference between your view and mine is that I can prove my view with hard evidence ............ and you can't.
    I can demonstrate exactly why it happened and how it was achieved. That is, I can identify the problem and having done that it is relatively easy to come up with a solution.
    If you want to prove me wrong .... explain how you come to your firmly held belief that the fall in value of the £ since the referendum was all due to the result of that vote? Put your reputation where your mouth is! :wink:

I think most people, who have even a smidgen of common sense, would accept that Sterling falling 5% in value just one day after the referendum, was 'hard evidence' enough that the "Leave" vote was fairly instrumental to the start of Pound's demise!! :roll:
However, where have I ever said that the ongoing fall was SOLELY "due to the result of that vote"? :? (Although, again, common sense would indicate that the decision to exit the EU is a fairly significant contributory factor!! 8) )
BTW, I look forward with bated breath for your 'easy solution' as to how we can make up the loss in our Euro income!! :roll: :lol: :lol:

Posted By: Mr Tibbs

  • mouse wrote:
    • Mr Tibbs wrote:
      • mouse wrote:
        It's funny that though, if you go back over recent times on the forum according to the Right wing fraternity on here the BBC are a Left wing organisation.
        Obviously not Right wing enough. :wink:

      Well, neutral would be nice I think. Isn't that in the Charter? Which also incidentally details the organisation's editorial independence.
      Of course, Left wingers would say it was balanced. Everything's like that when it's balanced in your direction.

    And Right wingers?

There's a code of honour. :wink: :lol:

Posted By: ProVox

You did ask ......
WW:
    Quote:
  • I think most people, who have even a smidgen of common sense, would accept that Sterling falling 5% in value just one day after the referendum, was 'hard evidence' enough that the "Leave" vote was fairly instrumental to the start of Pound's demise!!


No Woody ..... that is WHAT happened. You have not explained how! You say it was instrumental but don’t explain how ........ and I know you cannot do it without referring to the real cause of the devaluation ( currency fluctuation ) and that can only be attributable to the currency markets i.e. speculators!
    Quote:
  • However, where have I ever said that the ongoing fall was SOLELY "due to the result of that vote"? (Although, again, common sense would indicate that the decision to exit the EU is a fairly significant contributory factor!! )

Again ... that is not how it has changed the value ...... which you have always vigorously blamed on those that voted to leave. Brexit was a single event. Explain how that event changed the value of the currency and it would show I was wrong and it was the result that caused the initial fall. But, as a single event it could only do it once. All you need to do is prove your point ......... and you cannot do that without involving The Currency Markets!
    Quote:
  • BTW, I look forward with bated breath for your 'easy solution' as to how we can make up the loss in our Euro income!!


Well sarcasm aside .........
I never said you could recover the lost income, I said I could stop it happening again.And yes there is a very simple solution that would stop it happening again.
If you accept the currency speculators are the root cause ..... then you stop them speculating. That is how it used to be before the US abandoned paying their debts in gold in 1971 and dropped it completely in 1973. They had already created many times the value of gold they held, when other countries wanted their money back ( their gold ) the US could not pay, the IOU’s were not related to the value of gold anymore.
Then the only thing that changed the value of any currency in the short term was speculators ..... who worked for banks ...... who turned it into an ‘ essential ’ industry ........and made trillions for themselves ..... whilst contributing zilch to the real economy.
The US dollar and all other currencies were only worth face value i.e. what was printed on the face of what is now a Fiat currency backed only by the trust the customer had in the supplier. It declined in value ( by this I mean purchasing power ) over time. The US dollar is worth less than one hundredth of what it was worth at the beginning of the 20th Century, as are all fiat currencies.
There is also a simple solution to this as well, same MO ....prevent the cause, solve the problem, not just ‘ adjusting ’ the system to cover the symptoms!
So why don’t they solve the problem then? Because it would bring the commercial banks back to being an intermediary between lender and borrower, they would only be agents for, not the creator of currency. They would no longer make trillions off your wealth and that is your labour on which you are taxed both directly ( income tax, a totally unnecessary and illogical tax, which again only came into being for ordinary people in the beginning of the 20th Century when the FED was created ) and indirectly through sales tax ( VAT ) and all the other taxes and fees imposed by the government.
Tell me, would you accept your salary as a loan from your employer that you had to repay with interest or would you rather get it paid without the need to repay it to your employer and thus pay no interest either? Yes, it is an absolutely bonkers idea and only fools would agree to that. Unfortunately we fools have been deceived by the banks and that is EXACTLY how the Government, any government, funds its expenditure. It is a loan from commercial banks against government IOU’s that needs to be repaid with interest. That is why we have austerity! The government reduces its expenditure on social spending, to repay the bank out of the collected taxes.

Hence my interest in who creates this money and how .......... and it turns out to be the biggest fraud ever perpetrated on the human race!!!!!

Posted By: devil

  • ProVox wrote:
    You did ask ......
    Hence my interest in who creates this money and how .......... and it turns out to be the biggest fraud ever perpetrated on the human race!!!!!

The Oracle has spoken :roll:

Posted By: Pete The Highwayman

Morning provox You Carry on reading the marvellous daily mail And leave that toffee nose guardian alone Keep smiling and be lucky Pete

Posted By: ProVox

  • devil wrote:
    • ProVox wrote:
      You did ask ......
      Hence my interest in who creates this money and how .......... and it turns out to be the biggest fraud ever perpetrated on the human race!!!!!

    The Oracle has spoken :roll:

You may mock ..... but have you checked it out yet? I did give you links that gives the back up evidence to the claim and it is also fully supported by BoE, FED, Deutche Bank and many economists. You should try to be more professional.
Here is your chance ...... correct what I have said with your own explanation .
The only ones who mock it do so in ignorance ..... admit it! You obviously have no knowledge of the way the banking system works or how money is created and thus would be unable to understand that only currency markets can change the exchange rate of a currency.
How would you feel if I just dismissed out of hand, your climate change theory as just 'rubbish'? I wouldn't because I recognise that I don't have the knowledge to challenge you even if I thought it was rubbish ....... which I don't!
You obviously have no knowledge of the way the banking system works, how money is created ........... but still mock. :?

Posted By: devil

  • ProVox wrote:

    You obviously have no knowledge of the way the banking system works, how money is created ........... but still mock. :?

The Oracle speaks again :roll:

Posted By: ProVox

  • devil wrote:
    • ProVox wrote:

      You obviously have no knowledge of the way the banking system works, how money is created ........... but still mock. :?

    The Oracle speaks again :roll:

So you agree you have no knowledge on the subject and are unable to offer a sensible and reasoned response? :roll:

Posted By: Kwacka

  • ProVox wrote:
    • devil wrote:
      • ProVox wrote:

        You obviously have no knowledge of the way the banking system works, how money is created ........... but still mock. :?

      The Oracle speaks again :roll:

    So you agree you have no knowledge on the subject and are unable to offer a sensible and reasoned response? :roll:

I am unable to say how gravity works, and could not offer a reasoned response should I be asked.
However this does not mean that gravity does not exist, no matter how many times I am told that it doesn't - no matter by whom, nor how many, and no matter how initially fantasic/believable the comments are.
Yes, the value of money is imaginary, everybody knows that, but the concept you fail to grasp is that everybody believes the euro, dollar, credit card, cheque, sea-shells, gold, tokens, - and everything that has been used as money for the past 8,000 - 10,000 years has an accepted value.
Currencies rely upon trust - the more trust there is, the more valuable the coin. It hasn't, for several centuries, relied entirely upon buildings containing lumps of gold to back up that trust, protected by cages and armed guards.
Your incessant (and ill-considered) monologues on money are monotonous and boring.
Times have changed - live with it.

Posted By: Woodrow Why?at

  • ProVox wrote:
    You did ask ......
    WW:
      Quote:
    • I think most people, who have even a smidgen of common sense, would accept that Sterling falling 5% in value just one day after the referendum, was 'hard evidence' enough that the "Leave" vote was fairly instrumental to the start of Pound's demise!!


    No Woody ..... that is WHAT happened. You have not explained how! You say it was instrumental but don’t explain how ........ and I know you cannot do it without referring to the real cause of the devaluation ( currency fluctuation ) and that can only be attributable to the currency markets i.e. speculators!
      Quote:
    • However, where have I ever said that the ongoing fall was SOLELY "due to the result of that vote"? (Although, again, common sense would indicate that the decision to exit the EU is a fairly significant contributory factor!! )

    Again ... that is not how it has changed the value ...... which you have always vigorously blamed on those that voted to leave. Brexit was a single event. Explain how that event changed the value of the currency and it would show I was wrong and it was the result that caused the initial fall. But, as a single event it could only do it once. All you need to do is prove your point ......... and you cannot do that without involving The Currency Markets!
      Quote:
    • BTW, I look forward with bated breath for your 'easy solution' as to how we can make up the loss in our Euro income!!


    Well sarcasm aside .........
    I never said you could recover the lost income, I said I could stop it happening again .And yes there is a very simple solution that would stop it happening again.
    If you accept the currency speculators are the root cause ..... then you stop them speculating. That is how it used to be before the US abandoned paying their debts in gold in 1971 and dropped it completely in 1973. They had already created many times the value of gold they held, when other countries wanted their money back ( their gold ) the US could not pay, the IOU’s were not related to the value of gold anymore.
    Then the only thing that changed the value of any currency in the short term was speculators ..... who worked for banks ...... who turned it into an ‘ essential ’ industry ........and made trillions for themselves ..... whilst contributing zilch to the real economy.
    The US dollar and all other currencies were only worth face value i.e. what was printed on the face of what is now a Fiat currency backed only by the trust the customer had in the supplier. It declined in value ( by this I mean purchasing power ) over time. The US dollar is worth less than one hundredth of what it was worth at the beginning of the 20th Century, as are all fiat currencies.
    There is also a simple solution to this as well, same MO ....prevent the cause, solve the problem, not just ‘ adjusting ’ the system to cover the symptoms!
    So why don’t they solve the problem then? Because it would bring the commercial banks back to being an intermediary between lender and borrower, they would only be agents for, not the creator of currency. They would no longer make trillions off your wealth and that is your labour on which you are taxed both directly ( income tax, a totally unnecessary and illogical tax, which again only came into being for ordinary people in the beginning of the 20th Century when the FED was created ) and indirectly through sales tax ( VAT ) and all the other taxes and fees imposed by the government.
    Tell me, would you accept your salary as a loan from your employer that you had to repay with interest or would you rather get it paid without the need to repay it to your employer and thus pay no interest either? Yes, it is an absolutely bonkers idea and only fools would agree to that. Unfortunately we fools have been deceived by the banks and that is EXACTLY how the Government, any government, funds its expenditure. It is a loan from commercial banks against government IOU’s that needs to be repaid with interest. That is why we have austerity! The government reduces its expenditure on social spending, to repay the bank out of the collected taxes.

    Hence my interest in who creates this money and how .......... and it turns out to be the biggest fraud ever perpetrated on the human race!!!!!

Well, cutting through all the dross - which given your propensity for unnecessarily elongated posts is no easy task - I would respond by saying that some things are so glaringly obvious that absolute proof is not needed!!
(I've never been to the North Pole, so have no "proof", but I'm pretty sure it's rather cold there! :roll: :lol: )
And your reply (which I've highlighted) to my hope that you could advise on how to make up the loss in our Euro income, bears no similarity whatsoever to what you originally said, which was, " I can identify the problem and having done that it is relatively easy to come up with a solution. " 8)

Posted By: ProVox

    Quote:
    • Kwacka wrote:
      • ProVox wrote:
        • devil wrote:
          • ProVox wrote:

            You obviously have no knowledge of the way the banking system works, how money is created ........... but still mock. :?

          The Oracle speaks again :roll:

        So you agree you have no knowledge on the subject and are unable to offer a sensible and reasoned response? :roll:

      I am unable to say how gravity works, and could not offer a reasoned response should I be asked. (but would you tell people that believed Newton, that it was all rubbish?)

      However this does not mean that gravity does not exist, no matter how many times I am told that it doesn't - no matter by whom, nor how many, and no matter how initially fantasic/believable the comments are.
      Yes, the value of money is imaginary, everybody knows that, but the concept you fail to grasp is that everybody believes the euro, dollar, credit card, cheque, sea-shells, gold, tokens, - and everything that has been used as money for the past 8,000 - 10,000 years has an accepted value.
      For 8-10,000 years you had money ...... since 1973 ( actually starting around 1933 ) you have had fiat currencies .... the two are very different ..... but of course you know all that?
      Really? So bank assets have value? But the commercial banks assets are all debt, at least that is what the BoE believes! It is the collateral that has value not the currency...... and this is something you obviously fail to grasp. Currency is simply a means of transfer of wealth. But if every body believes what you are saying and they think it has value, then it must be true then and I have got it all wrong?
      Currencies rely upon trust - the more trust there is, the more valuable the coin. It hasn't, for several centuries, relied entirely upon buildings containing lumps of gold to back up that trust, protected by cages and armed guards.
      For Centuries we haven't had a gold standard? Nixon didn't seem to know that, because he seems to have dropped the gold standard centuries after it already ceased to exist. My goodness Kwacka, I have learned more from you in this one post, than I have over the last 12 years of finding out all about the subject!
      Your incessant (and ill-considered) monologues on money are monotonous and boring. ( SO DON'T READ THEM )
      Times have changed - live with it. ( Yes they have changed, you just seem to be a way behind in recognizing what those changes are!)
      Ill-considered? Pray tell me where I am going wrong so that I can be become as knowledgeable as you on the subject? Bl**dy Hell ..... all those years wasted on a 'conspiracy theory' .
      BTW: Have you informed the BoE that they have got it all wrong too?
      :roll:


Posted By: mouse

  • ProVox wrote:
    • devil wrote:
      • ProVox wrote:
        You did ask ......
        Hence my interest in who creates this money and how .......... and it turns out to be the biggest fraud ever perpetrated on the human race!!!!!

      The Oracle has spoken :roll:

    You may mock ..... but have you checked it out yet? I did give you links that gives the back up evidence to the claim and it is also fully supported by BoE, FED, Deutche Bank and many economists. You should try to be more professional.
    Here is your chance ...... correct what I have said with your own explanation .
    The only ones who mock it do so in ignorance ..... admit it! You obviously have no knowledge of the way the banking system works or how money is created and thus would be unable to understand that only currency markets can change the exchange rate of a currency.
    How would you feel if I just dismissed out of hand, your climate change theory as just 'rubbish'? I wouldn't because I recognise that I don't have the knowledge to challenge you even if I thought it was rubbish ....... which I don't!
    You obviously have no knowledge of the way the banking system works, how money is created ........... but still mock. :?

I think I agree that the speculater's control the money markets.
So do you agree the speculater's at the time liked the idea that the vote would be to stay in the EU hence the value of the pound shot up against the euro.
But when it was realised that the vote was going to be a Brexit the value of the pound crashed to well below to what it was even week's before the result was known, forget that it hit heights just the day before.
Going by that scenario do you agree that the speculater's would have preferred the UK to stay in the EU.
But I suppose another way of looking at it is that they made the pound go higher deliberately to buy euros, but that would have been counter productive, unless they wanted to make a killing by holding lot's of euro's to buy back a weaker pound.

Posted By: Kwacka

  • ProVox wrote:

    BTW: Have you informed the BoE that they have got it all wrong too? [/color] :roll:

Fiat money has been used from the 11th century, as everybody but conspiracy theorists have recognised.

Posted By: madmum

probably a not answering question but can anyone guess if exchange likely to drop even lower or improve soon down to not a lot in bank of cyprus account as not transfered any for few months. so cant decide whether just to transfer 2k anyway. keep waiting for rate to improve but see today dropped to 1.08 can of course withdraw from uk bank at atm but with charges is even worse

Posted By: ProVox

Mouse:
    Quote:
  • I think I agree that the speculator's control the money markets.

I see no other explanation. Short term fluctuation is how they make their money.
    Quote:
  • So do you agree the speculator's at the time liked the idea that the vote would be to stay in the EU hence the value of the pound shot up against the euro.

Quite probably ! But it was not a patriotic belief that drove that, it was the smell of future profit. IMO : The one thing they did not want to do was crash the UK’s real economy as that would have had serious effects on the financial economy, so they gave themselves a margin. It would have gone down anyway but maybe by a smaller amount had the vote gone the other way.

    Quote:
  • But when it was realised that the vote was going to be a Brexit the value of the pound crashed to well below to what it was even week's before the result was known, forget that it hit heights just the day before.

Panic selling ? It crashed because they converted the GBP to other currencies by frantically selling, not just to buy the Euro but also other currencies. IMO : Had the selling been less vigorous the initial fall would have been less than it was.
    Quote:
  • Going by that scenario do you agree that the speculator's would have preferred the UK to stay in the EU.

Yes ........ staying with the Titanic was a better scenario for them than the likely turmoil to their ‘industry’ by taking to the lifeboats. Short term fluctuation is how they make their money, the trend from which they really don’t make that much, is over time.
    Quote:
  • But I suppose another way of looking at it is that they made the pound go higher deliberately to buy euros, but that would have been counter productive, unless they wanted to make a killing by holding lot's of euro's to buy back a weaker pound.

They would buy GBP to increase the rate, started to sell on referendum day, which became a sharp drop in earnest after the vote result. But the currencies they bought went up in value against the GBP. They make their money short term. You are crediting the currency speculators of having a long term plan .......... IMO : they don’t look that far ahead.
The GBP was already on a downward trend in the last few years. IMO : Since the referendum result the fault for this lies with the ‘Moaners’ that from the first day after the result have been the purveyors of doom and gloom. They have bad mouthed the UK and this has continued this trend with the currency but has not really had a significant effect on the real economy. Had the vote been more decisive or the country generally had been more upbeat after the vote, I think it would have reversed that trend.
Then add a ’strong-and-stable’ government, that has turned out to be ‘weak-and-wobbly’ and it is going to be tough up-hill struggle against the determination of the EU Masters to punish the UK for their decision. So far this has been verbal .... it remains to be seen what happens when they start getting tough.
So I blame the speculators for the short term effects but the purveyors of doom, like Woody, for the continuance of the long term downward trend.

Posted By: Mr Tibbs

  • madmum wrote:
    probably a not answering question but can anyone guess if exchange likely to drop even lower or improve soon
    down to not a lot in bank of cyprus account as not transfered any for few months. so cant decide whether just to transfer 2k anyway. keep waiting for rate to improve but see today dropped to 1.08
    can of course withdraw from uk bank at atm but with charges is even worse

I think it's like asking who will win the 2.30 at Cheltenham :( The £ will surely though remain volatile for some time. The key to much of what's happening being the word volatile, which is like blood to the sharks.
AFAIUI a major factor is the strengthening €, which is also reflected in its increasing value against the $. This being brought about by the pro-EU election results in the Netherlands and France, coupled to what looks like Merkel's assured re-election in Germany next month. Furthermore, there's been a return to economic growth in the Federation. 2% is on the cards for this year.
Many though are predicting (a common term in Forex!) that this is an illusory bubble. The ECB has pumped €2 trillion into the economy, giving 1% growth per trillion (a good return?). This will inevitably end relatively soon though. The political factors are thought to be essentially illusory as well. Macron is not Napoleon after all, whilst the anti-Federalist cause remains, amongst other factors.
So to sum that up more succinctly................... dunno. :D

Posted By: ProVox

Woody:
As you find detailed explanations tedious I will keep this reply to a minimum.
ProVox said: Red highlights WW’s emphasis:
    Quote:
  • I never said you could recover the lost income, I said I could stop it happening again. And yes there is a very simple solution that would stop it happening again.

This next sentence is what is called a simple solution!
    Quote:

  • If you accept the currency speculators are the root cause (which even when including my detractors seems to be accepted)_..... then you stop them speculating.

ProVox said:
    Quote:
  • "I can identify the problem and having done that it is relatively easy to come up with a solution."

As I explained above. But let me endeavour to explain it simply .......
Problem = speculators speculating.
Solution = stop speculators speculating.
How, you legislate to impose rules that stop speculators speculating. ( Like the 1844 Bank Charter Act did to stop banks creating bank notes and coins. Similar problem, banking abuse of the system for self benefit ....... same solution ...... stop the abuse by legislating .)
What is it in those explanations which you asked for, that you have difficulty understanding? Or is it the whole subject that is too complex for you to understand? :roll:

Posted By: ProVox

  • Kwacka wrote:
    • ProVox wrote:

      BTW: Have you informed the BoE that they have got it all wrong too? [/color] :roll:

    Fiat money has been used from the 11th century, as everybody but conspiracy theorists have recognised.

I think you will find it goes back to Greek/Roman times even as far back as Egyptian Dynasty's! They created coins with a face value of gold but made of base metals. Fine all the time they could back them with gold, when they couldn't they became fiat money.
But well done ..... if you don't really have argument throw in the 'conspiracy theory' instead .......... bit like climate change and religion?
I am afraid ' most ' people do not even know what a fiat currency is or the difference between it and money! :roll:

Posted By: ProVox

  • madmum wrote:
    probably a not answering question but can anyone guess if exchange likely to drop even lower or improve soon
    down to not a lot in bank of cyprus account as not transfered any for few months. so cant decide whether just to transfer 2k anyway. keep waiting for rate to improve but see today dropped to 1.08
    can of course withdraw from uk bank at atm but with charges is even worse

IMO: I think they will avoid parity with the Euro as, once that benchmark is reached it is a psychological barrier to re-cross it. The future trend can be no more than guesswork and speculation.
Currency will always fluctuate .... if it didn't the speculators would not make money. :wink:

Posted By: Woodrow Why?at

  • ProVox wrote:
    Mouse:
      Quote:
    • So do you agree the speculator's at the time liked the idea that the vote would be to stay in the EU hence the value of the pound shot up against the euro.

    Quite probably ! But it was not a patriotic belief that drove that, it was the smell of future profit. IMO : The one thing they did not want to do was crash the UK’s real economy as that would have had serious effects on the financial economy, so they gave themselves a margin. It would have gone down anyway but maybe by a smaller amount had the vote gone the other way.

      Quote:
    • But when it was realised that the vote was going to be a Brexit the value of the pound crashed to well below to what it was even week's before the result was known, forget that it hit heights just the day before.

    Panic selling ? It crashed because they converted the GBP to other currencies by frantically selling, not just to buy the Euro but also other currencies. IMO : Had the selling been less vigorous the initial fall would have been less than it was.
      Quote:
    • Going by that scenario do you agree that the speculator's would have preferred the UK to stay in the EU.

    Yes ........ staying with the Titanic was a better scenario for them than the likely turmoil to their ‘industry’ by taking to the lifeboats . Short term fluctuation is how they make their money, the trend from which they really don’t make that much, is over time.

Hallelujah!! \:D/ A 'road to Damascus' moment!! :shock: PV finally accepts the 'Leave' vote DID contribute to the Pound's fall!!!!!! :roll: :lol: :lol:

Posted By: Woodrow Why?at

  • ProVox wrote:
    Woody:
    As you find detailed explanations tedious I will keep this reply to a minimum.
    ProVox said: Red highlights WW’s emphasis:
      Quote:
    • I never said you could recover the lost income, I said I could stop it happening again. And yes there is a very simple solution that would stop it happening again.

    This next sentence is what is called a simple solution!
      Quote:

    • If you accept the currency speculators are the root cause (which even when including my detractors seems to be accepted)_..... then you stop them speculating.

    ProVox said:
      Quote:
    • "I can identify the problem and having done that it is relatively easy to come up with a solution."

    As I explained above. But let me endeavour to explain it simply .......
    Problem = speculators speculating.
    Solution = stop speculators speculating.
    How, you legislate to impose rules that stop speculators speculating. ( Like the 1844 Bank Charter Act did to stop banks creating bank notes and coins. Similar problem, banking abuse of the system for self benefit ....... same solution ...... stop the abuse by legislating .)
    What is it in those explanations which you asked for, that you have difficulty understanding? Or is it the whole subject that is too complex for you to understand ? :roll:

I'm afraid I still don't see any similarity between your two stated sentences! :?
Then again, you could be correct in that the subject is too complex for me! :oops:
(You know, the same as the difference in the words 'Leave' and 'Remain' can be too complex for you!! :lol: :lol: )

Posted By: mouse

  • Woodrow Why?at wrote:
    • ProVox wrote:
      Mouse:
        Quote:
      • So do you agree the speculator's at the time liked the idea that the vote would be to stay in the EU hence the value of the pound shot up against the euro.

      Quite probably ! But it was not a patriotic belief that drove that, it was the smell of future profit. IMO : The one thing they did not want to do was crash the UK’s real economy as that would have had serious effects on the financial economy, so they gave themselves a margin. It would have gone down anyway but maybe by a smaller amount had the vote gone the other way.

        Quote:
      • But when it was realised that the vote was going to be a Brexit the value of the pound crashed to well below to what it was even week's before the result was known, forget that it hit heights just the day before.

      Panic selling ? It crashed because they converted the GBP to other currencies by frantically selling, not just to buy the Euro but also other currencies. IMO : Had the selling been less vigorous the initial fall would have been less than it was.
        Quote:
      • Going by that scenario do you agree that the speculator's would have preferred the UK to stay in the EU.

      Yes ........ staying with the Titanic was a better scenario for them than the likely turmoil to their ‘industry’ by taking to the lifeboats . Short term fluctuation is how they make their money, the trend from which they really don’t make that much, is over time.

    Hallelujah!! \:D/ A 'road to Damascus' moment!! :shock: PV finally accepts the 'Leave' vote DID contribute to the Pound's fall!!!!!! :roll: :lol: :lol:

That's because I asked the right question, in the correct manner.

Posted By: ProVox

  • Woodrow Why?at wrote:
    • ProVox wrote:
      Mouse:
        Quote:
      • So do you agree the speculator's at the time liked the idea that the vote would be to stay in the EU hence the value of the pound shot up against the euro.

      Quite probably ! But it was not a patriotic belief that drove that, it was the smell of future profit. IMO : The one thing they did not want to do was crash the UK’s real economy as that would have had serious effects on the financial economy, so they gave themselves a margin. It would have gone down anyway but maybe by a smaller amount had the vote gone the other way.
      Because they would not have panicked. Remain had the greater degree of probability ...... leave came as a surprise!
        Quote:
      • But when it was realised that the vote was going to be a Brexit the value of the pound crashed to well below to what it was even week's before the result was known, forget that it hit heights just the day before.

      Panic selling ? It crashed because they converted the GBP to other currencies by frantically selling, not just to buy the Euro but also other currencies. IMO : Had the selling been less vigorous the initial fall would have been less than it was.
        Quote:
      • Going by that scenario do you agree that the speculator's would have preferred the UK to stay in the EU.

      Yes ........ staying with the Titanic was a better scenario for them than the likely turmoil to their ‘industry’ by taking to the lifeboats . Short term fluctuation is how they make their money, the trend from which they really don’t make that much, is over time.

    Hallelujah!! \:D/ A 'road to Damascus' moment!! :shock: PV finally accepts the 'Leave' vote DID contribute to the Pound's fall!!!!!! :roll: :lol: :lol:

Really .... did I say that or are you confusing me with someone else?
You professed it was the idiots that voted for Brexit that were responsible for the drop in your pension ( and mine ) ........ I disagreed and said the only people capable of doing that are currency speculators, so I blame speculators. Nothing has changed! Until you demonstrate how voters changed the rate you have not proved your argument.

Posted By: ProVox

Mouse:
    Quote:
  • That's because I asked the right question, in the correct manner.

Very true, you were polite and your questions were related solely to the actions of speculators ...... not to stupid morons that voted to leave. I answered them honestly and noted where I was expressing my opinion as opposed to stating obvious facts.
So I can't see why Woody is so euphoric with his 'road-to-Damascus' moment. He still hasn't told us how he came to blame the Brexit vote for his loss of pension in the first place.
But he and others like him are the purveyors of doom that set the atmosphere for the speculators to paint a poor picture of the UK's future, although of course the economy seems to be holding up well. So we are back to speculators making money and any excuse will do! :wink:

Posted By: Woodrow Why?at

  • ProVox wrote:
    • Woodrow Why?at wrote:
      • ProVox wrote:
        Mouse:
          Quote:
        • So do you agree the speculator's at the time liked the idea that the vote would be to stay in the EU hence the value of the pound shot up against the euro.

        Quite probably ! But it was not a patriotic belief that drove that, it was the smell of future profit. IMO : The one thing they did not want to do was crash the UK’s real economy as that would have had serious effects on the financial economy, so they gave themselves a margin. It would have gone down anyway but maybe by a smaller amount had the vote gone the other way.
        Because they would not have panicked. Remain had the greater degree of probability ...... leave came as a surprise!
          Quote:
        • But when it was realised that the vote was going to be a Brexit the value of the pound crashed to well below to what it was even week's before the result was known, forget that it hit heights just the day before.

        Panic selling ? It crashed because they converted the GBP to other currencies by frantically selling, not just to buy the Euro but also other currencies. IMO : Had the selling been less vigorous the initial fall would have been less than it was.
          Quote:
        • Going by that scenario do you agree that the speculator's would have preferred the UK to stay in the EU.

        Yes ........ staying with the Titanic was a better scenario for them than the likely turmoil to their ‘industry’ by taking to the lifeboats . Short term fluctuation is how they make their money, the trend from which they really don’t make that much, is over time.

      Hallelujah!! \:D/ A 'road to Damascus' moment!! :shock: PV finally accepts the 'Leave' vote DID contribute to the Pound's fall!!!!!! :roll: :lol: :lol:

    Really .... did I say that or are you confusing me with someone else?
    Until you demonstrate how voters changed the rate you have not proved your argument.

I don't think that anybody could ever confuse you, and your illogical stance on this matter, with anyone else!! 8)
And, as I previously stated, some things are so glaringly obvious that absolute proof becomes unnecessary!! :roll:

Posted By: Kwacka

  • kwacka wrote:

    Your incessant (and ill-considered) monologues on money are monotonous and boring.

  • provox wrote:
    SO DON'T READ THEM

If I didn't read as many posts as I could, I feel I'd be failing in my duty as a moderator. The idea is to filter out any insults, foul language (but this is usually caught by the auto-moderator), offensive posts and anything else that contradicts the forum rules.
Unfortunately Admin hasn't given us the rights to filter out ill-informed repetitive and over-long ill-informed posts.
It appears that your username is the antithesis of your attitude unless, of course, the only vox you consider pro is your's - and you attempt to silence others by producing the same boring, monotonous script as previously, with a couple of insults thrown in for good measure.
But thanks for the opportunity to repeat my comment about
    Quote:
  • Your incessant (and ill-considered) monologues on money are monotonous and boring..
:wink:
BTW, I also don't agree with your comment
  • ProVox wrote:

    not to stupid morons that voted to leave.

A great way to win friends! :shock:

Posted By: Mr Tibbs

  • Woodrow Why?at wrote:
    I don't think that anybody could ever confuse you, and your illogical stance on this matter, with anyone else!! 8)

Thank you Woody. I like to think that my illogical stances are unique to me. :wink: :D

Posted By: Woodrow Why?at

  • ProVox wrote:
    Mouse:
      Quote:
    • That's because I asked the right question, in the correct manner.

    Very true, you were polite and your questions were related solely to the actions of speculators ......
    So I can't see why Woody is so euphoric with his 'road-to-Damascus' moment.

Yes, mouse is generally quite polite on here! :)
He, for example, wouldn't be so rude as to say that somebody he disagrees with 'posts like a simpleton'!! 8)
And, to be fair, I wasn't that euphoric! :wink:

Posted By: Woodrow Why?at

  • Mr Tibbs wrote:
    • Woodrow Why?at wrote:
      I don't think that anybody could ever confuse you, and your illogical stance on this matter, with anyone else!! 8)

    Thank you Woody. I like to think that my illogical stances are unique to me. :wink: :D

You definitely bring your own form of uniqueness to the party, Mr T! :wink: :lol:

Posted By: Mr Tibbs

  • Woodrow Why?at wrote:
    • Mr Tibbs wrote:
      • Woodrow Why?at wrote:
        I don't think that anybody could ever confuse you, and your illogical stance on this matter, with anyone else!! 8)

      Thank you Woody. I like to think that my illogical stances are unique to me. :wink: :D

    You definitely bring your own form of uniqueness to the party, Mr T! :wink: :lol:

Indeed. I set out to beat your record for deleted posts recently, proving your rank amateurishness in the matter. :shock: :( :lol:

Posted By: sugarray1955

Love this thread, better than watching The comedians :D :D :D

Posted By: Woodrow Why?at

  • Mr Tibbs wrote:
    • Woodrow Why?at wrote:
      • Mr Tibbs wrote:
        • Woodrow Why?at wrote:
          I don't think that anybody could ever confuse you, and your illogical stance on this matter, with anyone else!! 8)

        Thank you Woody. I like to think that my illogical stances are unique to me. :wink: :D

      You definitely bring your own form of uniqueness to the party, Mr T! :wink: :lol:

    Indeed. I set out to beat your record for deleted posts recently, proving your rank amateurishness in the matter. :shock: :( :lol:

Actually, I haven't had a post deleted for some time now!! \:D/ (oops, am I being 'euphoric' again? :lol: ) but may be because I've been taking lessons from mouse on how to be more polite! :wink:

Posted By: Mr Tibbs

  • kwacka wrote:
    If I didn't read as many posts as I could, I feel I'd be failing in my duty as a moderator. The idea is to filter out any insults...............

I take it you've been on holiday recently? :lol: :lol: :lol:

Posted By: emanon

Just a quick comment on interest rates affecting the value of the pound. Does anyone remember when Lamont, I think it was, who was shadowing the DMark, and interest rates went up momentarily to 15%, at which point he came out of the EMF?

Posted By: Mr Tibbs

  • emanon wrote:
    Just a quick comment on interest rates affecting the value of the pound. Does anyone remember when Lamont, I think it was, who was shadowing the DMark, and interest rates went up momentarily to 15%, at which point he came out of the EMF?

Have a look at the link on #184. :wink:

Posted By: ProVox

  • Kwacka wrote:
    • kwacka wrote:

      Your incessant (and ill-considered) monologues on money are monotonous and boring.

    • provox wrote:
      SO DON'T READ THEM

    If I didn't read as many posts as I could, I feel I'd be failing in my duty as a moderator. The idea is to filter out any insults, foul language (but this is usually caught by the auto-moderator), offensive posts and anything else that contradicts the forum rules.
    Unfortunately Admin hasn't given us the rights to filter out ill-informed repetitive and over-long ill-informed posts.
    It appears that your username is the antithesis of your attitude unless, of course, the only vox you consider pro is your's - and you attempt to silence others by producing the same boring, monotonous script as previously, with a couple of insults thrown in for good measure.
    But thanks for the opportunity to repeat my comment about
      Quote:
    • Your incessant (and ill-considered) monologues on money are monotonous and boring..
    :wink:
    BTW, I also don't agree with your comment
    • ProVox wrote:

      not to stupid morons that voted to leave.
      It was Woody's 'quote' not mine and Mouse did not refer to it ..... he is obviously smarter than the average mouse

    A great way to win friends! :shock:

I have posted the sources that back what I try to pass on, all of them very respected and impeccably informed sources ...... all you have provided so far, as do most that ridicule the idea, is simply your un-informed opinion! :roll:

Posted By: Pete The Highwayman

Afternoon All my working life and I did not retire until I was 75 years old All that time I worked in the motor trade I have seen most tricks pulled And I always thought the motor trade was the most crooked game Known to man but I was wrong the most crooked game known to man Is the money game an absolute job for the boys It's as bent as a nine bob note Pete

Posted By: Woodrow Why?at

  • ProVox wrote:
    • Kwacka wrote:
      • kwacka wrote:

        BTW, I also don't agree with your comment
        • ProVox wrote:

          not to stupid morons that voted to leave.
          It was Woody's 'quote' not mine......

        A great way to win friends! :shock:


    :? PV, as you are so big on 'facts' and 'proof' you will obviously have no problem in providing evidence that the 'quote' you attributed to me was actually mine, as I have no recollection of ever using such words!! [-X

Posted By: ProVox

  • Pete The Highwayman wrote:
    Afternoon
    All my working life and I did not retire until I was 75 years old
    All that time I worked in the motor trade I have seen most tricks pulled
    And I always thought the motor trade was the most crooked game
    Known to man but I was wrong the most crooked game known to man
    Is the money game an absolute job for the boys
    It's as bent as a nine bob note
    Pete

I'm 76 and still working although not so hard and now on 'home-and-garden' projects, and not as long these days.
No matter how hard I have tried to explain the facts about ' the money game (racket)' I have failed to get through to most people. It is difficult when their heads are full of preconceived ideas, basically all the wrong ideas. As you can see from this thread.
Now Kwacka will tell you there is no such thing as a 'nine-bob-note' :wink: :D

Posted By: Pete The Highwayman

Hey provox I said I retired at 75 years old my next one next February It will be the sunset strip for me Keep smiling Pete

Posted By: ProVox

  • Woodrow Why?at wrote:
    • ProVox wrote:
      • Kwacka wrote:
        • kwacka wrote:

          BTW, I also don't agree with your comment
          • ProVox wrote:

            not to stupid morons that voted to leave.
            It was Woody's 'quote' not mine......

          A great way to win friends! :shock:


      :? PV, as you are so big on 'facts' and 'proof' you will obviously have no problem in providing evidence that the 'quote' you attributed to me was actually mine, as I have no recollection of ever using such words!! [-X

    Well I agree I should have put the words between inverted commas i.e. ‘ quote ’, which I would suggest infers not strictly accurate.
    I apologise if it offends you but I don’t think anyone was fooled by your intent when you did say “..... the dense population of the UK ......” when referring to the result of the vote as obviously you only believed those that voted ‘ leave ’ met that description.
    Thesaurus:
    Dense: stupid, unintelligent, dim, slow, thick, brainless, dim witted, simple minded ......moronic even? :roll:

Posted By: Woodrow Why?at

  • ProVox wrote:
    • Woodrow Why?at wrote:
      • ProVox wrote:
        • Kwacka wrote:
          • kwacka wrote:

            BTW, I also don't agree with your comment
            • ProVox wrote:

              not to stupid morons that voted to leave.
              It was Woody's 'quote' not mine......

            A great way to win friends! :shock:


        :? PV, as you are so big on 'facts' and 'proof' you will obviously have no problem in providing evidence that the 'quote' you attributed to me was actually mine, as I have no recollection of ever using such words!! [-X

      Well I agree I should have put the words between inverted commas i.e. ‘ quote ’, which I would suggest infers not strictly accurate.
      I apologise if it offends you but I don’t think anyone was fooled by your intent when you did say “..... the dense population of the UK ......” when referring to the result of the vote as obviously you only believed those that voted ‘ leave ’ met that description.
      Thesaurus:
      Dense: stupid, unintelligent, dim, slow, thick, brainless, dim witted, simple minded ......moronic even? :roll:

    Oh, please don't concern yourself, I'm not easily offended and the 'fact' that you, for once, admitted you were wrong is apology enough! 8)
    Incidentally, another definition of the word 'dense' is "thickly crowded" which given that most be-leavers voted out because they were concerned about more immigration, is equally applicable!! :wink:

Posted By: Kwacka

  • ProVox wrote:

    Dense: stupid, unintelligent, dim, slow, thick, brainless, dim witted, simple minded ......moronic even? :roll:

Nice bit of cherry-picking to excuse your (almost) apology. :roll:
    Quote:
  • ADJECTIVE
    1. Closely compacted in substance .
    ‘as the storm cleared, a dense fog came down’
    1.1 Having the constituent parts crowded closely together.
    ‘she made her way through the dense undergrowth’
    2. informal (of a person) stupid.
    ‘Am I being dense? I don't quite understand’
    3. ( of a text) hard to understand because of its complexity of ideas.
    ‘a dark, dense novel’.

https://en.oxforddictionaries.com/definition/dense

Posted By: Kwacka

  • ProVox wrote:

    I'm 76 and still working although not so hard and now on 'home-and-garden' projects, and not as long these days.
    No matter how hard I have tried to explain the facts about ' the money game (racket)' I have failed to get through to most people. It is difficult when their heads are full of preconceived ideas, basically all the wrong ideas. As you can see from this thread.
    Now Kwacka will tell you there is no such thing as a 'nine-bob-note' :wink: :D

Why not ask your good friend to tell you all about the Rothschilds and the Federal Reserve Bank - via a private email, of course - he's already explained it to here. :shock:
BTW, I am familiar with the homophobic expression 'bent as a nine-bob note'. :(

Posted By: ProVox

  • Kwacka wrote:
    • ProVox wrote:

      Dense: stupid, unintelligent, dim, slow, thick, brainless, dim witted, simple minded ......moronic even? :roll:

    Nice bit of cherry-picking to excuse your (almost) apology. :roll:
      Quote:
    • ADJECTIVE
      1. Closely compacted in substance .
      ‘as the storm cleared, a dense fog came down’
      1.1 Having the constituent parts crowded closely together.
      ‘she made her way through the dense undergrowth’
      2. informal (of a person) stupid. (You have to be simple if you believe that WW meant anything other than 'dense' as in.......)
      ‘Am I being dense? (stupid, unintelligent, dim, slow, thick, brainless, dim witted, simple minded) I don't quite understand’
      3. ( of a text) hard to understand because of its complexity of ideas.
      ‘a dark, dense novel’.

    https://en.oxforddictionaries.com/definition/dense

I apologised and explained why .... what do you want ..... BLOOD? I don't think I have ever seen you offer an apology for anything you have ever said to anybody so, at least I am willing to admit when I make a mistake or an error of judgement, which is more than I could say for you.
Unlike you I tend to stick to the few subjects I have knowledge on and frequently separate opinion from proven fact ...... I do not run people down on something I have little knowledge of I am not that arrogant.
I will continue to post on subjects that interest me or those on which I have an opinion. If you don't like my views that is just tough or you could just not read them and save yourself the tedium of doing so.

Posted By: Woodrow Why?at

  • ProVox wrote:
    • Kwacka wrote:
      • ProVox wrote:

        Dense: stupid, unintelligent, dim, slow, thick, brainless, dim witted, simple minded ......moronic even? :roll:

      Nice bit of cherry-picking to excuse your (almost) apology. :roll:
        Quote:
      • ADJECTIVE
        1. Closely compacted in substance .
        ‘as the storm cleared, a dense fog came down’
        1.1 Having the constituent parts crowded closely together.
        ‘she made her way through the dense undergrowth’
        2. informal (of a person) stupid. (You have to be simple if you believe that WW meant anything other than 'dense' as in.......)
        ‘Am I being dense? (stupid, unintelligent, dim, slow, thick, brainless, dim witted, simple minded) I don't quite understand’
        3. ( of a text) hard to understand because of its complexity of ideas.
        ‘a dark, dense novel’.

      https://en.oxforddictionaries.com/definition/dense

    I apologised and explained why .... what do you want ..... BLOOD?

Well, I'd certainly settle for that! :wink: :lol: :lol:

Posted By: Kwacka

  • ProVox wrote:
    Well I agree I should have put the words between inverted commas i.e. ‘quote’, which I would suggest infers not strictly accurate.
    I apologise if it offends you but I don’t think anyone was fooled by your intent when you did say “..... the dense population of the UK ......” when referring to the result of the vote as obviously you only believed those that voted ‘leave’ met that description.
    Thesaurus:
    Dense: stupid, unintelligent, dim, slow, thick, brainless, dim witted, simple minded ......moronic even? Rolling Eyes

Yup, that reads like an apology :roll:

Posted By: mouse

  • Pete The Highwayman wrote:
    Hey provox
    I said I retired at 75 years old my next one next February
    It will be the sunset strip for me
    Keep smiling
    Pete

Plenty of life in the old dog yet Pete.
And you ain't bad for an SOS, :wink: :lol:

Posted By: Pete The Highwayman

Kwacka Being as you are cleverer than me I looked up homophobic And it said I had a fear of old queens well let me tell you When I drove a London cab I picked up more old queens Than you have had hot dinners and as long as they leave me alone I ain't got nothing against them so put that in your pipe and smoke it Pete

Posted By: Gerry McMahon

So how does the the future look for those who have to survive on our PENSIONS ,and will it go on like this for the next 2 to 3 years untill BREXIT is sorted???? Or should we scrap BREXIT NOW !!!

Posted By: devil

  • Gerry McMahon wrote:
    So how does the the future look for those who have to survive on our
    PENSIONS ,and will it go on like this for the next 2 to 3 years untill
    BREXIT is sorted???? Or should we scrap BREXIT NOW !!!

Who knows? No one here knows. No one in London knows (least of all Theresa May).

Posted By: ProVox

  • devil wrote:
    • Gerry McMahon wrote:
      So how does the the future look for those who have to survive on our
      PENSIONS ,and will it go on like this for the next 2 to 3 years untill
      BREXIT is sorted???? Or should we scrap BREXIT NOW !!!

    Who knows? No one here knows. No one in London knows (least of all Theresa May).

Even the speculators don't know! It's all guesswork.

Posted By: Mr Tibbs

  • Gerry McMahon wrote:
    So how does the the future look for those who have to survive on our
    PENSIONS ,and will it go on like this for the next 2 to 3 years untill
    BREXIT is sorted???? Or should we scrap BREXIT NOW !!!

I think the assumption that things would go back to previous levels for sterling could be mistaken. The pound was heading for a significant "correction" even before the vote and would still, I imagine, be regarded as a volatile currency.
The possibility of some mish-mash deal being done, where the UK leaves the EU, but actually doesn't, still remains. Outright cancellation appears unlikely, given that both major parties campaigned on the basis of a clean break.
There's always the possibility (I personally think highly likely) that in the not too distant future the markets will decide that the € is over valued.
As has been said though - who knows? :?

Posted By: Pete The Highwayman

Kwacka I had plenty of advances but I always told them Your the wrong shape Keep smiling Pete

Posted By: Kwacka

  • Pete The Highwayman wrote:
    Kwacka
    I had plenty of advances but I always told them
    Your the wrong shape
    Keep smiling
    Pete

Should have stopped wearing that zircon-encrusted tiara for work. :lol:

Posted By: geof j

havent read all the comments, but have seen the £ almost 1 for 1 even before any referendum on brexit, currencies are volatile and are exposed to speculators, which will always be amongst the midst of investors. at the mo the pound is 1.08/9, i have seen it less before a brexit vote, so can Brexit be to blame? Britains Economy is strong, is Europes? i cannot understand how strong the Euro continues to be against the face of adversity. immigration, allowed by Europe at unprecedented rates continues to grow, these people have to be paid for,they have to be housed,educated, and receive health care, but the EURO remains strong?it beggars belief how! the "Deutshmark"/ "French Franc "cannot keep supporting the EU economy, their will be a collapse caused by other EU countries withdrawing support. The EU Ponzi scheme cannot continue, its about time the EU looked at Economics and Economies, rather than they impose a system which is unworkable

Posted By: ProVox

  • geof j wrote:
    havent read all the comments, but have seen the £ almost 1 for 1 even before any referendum on brexit,
    currencies are volatile and are exposed to speculators, which will always be amongst the midst of investors.
    at the mo the pound is 1.08/9, i have seen it less before a brexit vote, so can Brexit be to blame?
    Britains Economy is strong, is Europes? i cannot understand how strong the Euro continues to be against the face of adversity.
    immigration, allowed by Europe at unprecedented rates continues to grow, these people have to be paid for,they have to be housed,educated, and receive health care, but the EURO remains strong?it beggars belief how!
    the "Deutshmark"/ "French Franc "cannot keep supporting the EU economy, their will be a collapse caused by other EU countries withdrawing support.
    The EU Ponzi scheme cannot continue, its about time the EU looked at Economics and Economies, rather than they impose a system which is unworkable

Careful Geof .... you are applying common sense and looking at the whole picture. I was about to make a similar observation!
I am more convinced than ever that the fall in the value of the GBP is driven by political considerations, not economics! The EU cannot let Brexit be seen to work as they know their precious United States of Europe would then vaporise as other states under stress would follow the UK.
Only my opinion, of course. :roll: :wink:

Posted By: romatarot

  • geof j wrote:
    havent read all the comments, but have seen the £ almost 1 for 1 even before any referendum on brexit,
    currencies are volatile and are exposed to speculators, which will always be amongst the midst of investors.
    at the mo the pound is 1.08/9, i have seen it less before a brexit vote, so can Brexit be to blame?
    Britains Economy is strong, is Europes? i cannot understand how strong the Euro continues to be against the face of adversity.
    immigration, allowed by Europe at unprecedented rates continues to grow, these people have to be paid for,they have to be housed,educated, and receive health care, but the EURO remains strong?it beggars belief how!
    the "Deutshmark"/ "French Franc "cannot keep supporting the EU economy, their will be a collapse caused by other EU countries withdrawing support.
    The EU Ponzi scheme cannot continue, its about time the EU looked at Economics and Economies, rather than they impose a system which is unworkable

I quote directly from 'Adults in the Room' by Yiannis Varoufakis, Chapter Three 'They Bend Their Tongues Like Their Bows', page 52/3:
" To grasp the ingenuity with which two Greek bankers solved the problem (November 2011 Bailout) it helps to know a joke I was once told in a Dublin pub involving two entrepreneurial drunkards.
Art and Conn, goes the tale, decide that they have to do something to lift themselves out of poverty, so they persuade Olcan, a local publican, to lend them a barrel of whiskey. Their plan is to roll it down the road to the next town where a fete is to be held, where they will sell its contents by the cup. Rolling the barrel along the road, they stop for a rest under a great oak. While they are sitting under the tree, Art finds a shilling in his pocket, rejoices and asks, 'Hey, Conn, if I give you a shilling can I have a cup of our whiskey?'
'Aye, go on,' replies he, pocketing the shilling.
A minute later Conn realizes he now has a shilling to spend, turns to his companion and asks, 'Art, what do you say? If I give you a shilling can I also have a cup?'
'Aye, Conn,' Art agrees, taking back his shilling.
And so they proceed, the shilling changing hands, until hours later Art and Conn are fast asleep under the oak tree with great grins on their faces, the barrel empty.
Back to me. Basically, upon the insistence of the ECB, EUC and the IMF, who were demanding that before they received more public money, the greek banks had to raise some of their own. This they did 'a la Art and Conn', by founding offshore companies, secretly lending each other millions of euros without (secretly, of course) any collateral or guarantees. They then used the 'monies' from their offshore accounts to buy new shares in their own banks, thus fulfilling the regulators' requirement for new capital to be raised so they could qualify for the new capital. They, however, didn't have to face Orcan the publican's as they wrote off each others' loans, in effect owing nothing to anyone.
This is almost a direct replica of the Savings and Loans scam in US during the 1980s.
In this scam, however, the Greek banks also successfully enlisted the help of not only the ECB, but also the IMF and European Union's Commission!

Posted By: Kwacka

  • geof j wrote:
    havent read all the comments, but have seen the £ almost 1 for 1 even before any referendum on brexit,
    currencies are volatile and are exposed to speculators, which will always be amongst the midst of investors.
    at the mo the pound is 1.08/9, i have seen it less before a brexit vote, so can Brexit be to blame?
    Britains Economy is strong, is Europes? i cannot understand how strong the Euro continues to be against the face of adversity.
    immigration, allowed by Europe at unprecedented rates continues to grow, these people have to be paid for,they have to be housed,educated, and receive health care, but the EURO remains strong?it beggars belief how!
    the "Deutshmark"/ "French Franc "cannot keep supporting the EU economy, their will be a collapse caused by other EU countries withdrawing support.
    The EU Ponzi scheme cannot continue, its about time the EU looked at Economics and Economies, rather than they impose a system which is unworkable

Britain's economy is not strong, what leads you to think that it is?
Why do you say that the EU allows immigration is allowed 'at unprecedented levels'? Refugees are allowed (as they are elsewhere) but migrants are not, unless they meet required criteria (work permits & health insurance, for example).
What about the dollar, yen and renminbi 'ponzi schemes'?

Posted By: Pete The Highwayman

Afternoon In today's marvellous daily mail the French unemployment is 9.5 percent England is 4.5 percent so I don't think there is Anything wrong with our economy with them figures And by the way kwacka I keep my hair very short so a diamond tiara Would not stay on Pete

Posted By: ProVox

Kwacka
    Quote:
  • Britain's economy is not strong, what leads you to think that it is?

Were we not told it would drop into recession if the referendum result was for a Brexit? It didn’t! It may not be strong but which economies are in Europe?
This is Moody’s assessment. Mind you this is the same Moodys that had Lehman Bros down as an AAA rating the day before it went bust and all the other AAA Ponzi schemes had to be bailed-out by the FED as well !!!! They are still propping them up now.
http://www.reuters.com/article/fitch-economy-debt-still-key-to-uk-ratin-idUSFit996531
    Quote:
  • Why do you say that the EU allows immigration is allowed 'at unprecedented levels'? Refugees are allowed (as they are elsewhere) but migrants are not, unless they meet required criteria (work permits & health insurance, for example).

So all this we see on the news about the problems nearly all EU countries are having with immigrants is all fake news then? The only ones not affected are those that shut them out.
    Quote:
  • What about the dollar, yen and renminbi 'ponzi schemes'?

What is it these people know that apparently you don’t?
They are already getting ready to protect themselves when the Petro Dollar collapses. I wonder if maybe they know that the Worlds No1 reserve currency is just that ..... a Ponzi scheme, a Fiat currency backed by ...... well nothing but the ‘Trust Me’ principal, the same one Cypriot developers have used for years! So are all the other currencies because everything is tied to the Petro Dollar. The problem is the trust is running out and ALL Ponzi schemes collapse eventually.
But you just carry on believing it’s all one big conspiracy theory!





:roll:

Posted By: ProVox

  • romatarot wrote:
    • geof j wrote:
      havent read all the comments, but have seen the £ almost 1 for 1 even before any referendum on brexit,
      currencies are volatile and are exposed to speculators, which will always be amongst the midst of investors.
      at the mo the pound is 1.08/9, i have seen it less before a brexit vote, so can Brexit be to blame?
      Britains Economy is strong, is Europes? i cannot understand how strong the Euro continues to be against the face of adversity.
      immigration, allowed by Europe at unprecedented rates continues to grow, these people have to be paid for,they have to be housed,educated, and receive health care, but the EURO remains strong?it beggars belief how!
      the "Deutshmark"/ "French Franc "cannot keep supporting the EU economy, their will be a collapse caused by other EU countries withdrawing support.
      The EU Ponzi scheme cannot continue, its about time the EU looked at Economics and Economies, rather than they impose a system which is unworkable

    I quote directly from 'Adults in the Room' by Yiannis Varoufakis, Chapter Three 'They Bend Their Tongues Like Their Bows', page 52/3:
    " To grasp the ingenuity with which two Greek bankers solved the problem (November 2011 Bailout) it helps to know a joke I was once told in a Dublin pub involving two entrepreneurial drunkards.
    Art and Conn, goes the tale, decide that they have to do something to lift themselves out of poverty, so they persuade Olcan, a local publican, to lend them a barrel of whiskey. Their plan is to roll it down the road to the next town where a fete is to be held, where they will sell its contents by the cup. Rolling the barrel along the road, they stop for a rest under a great oak. While they are sitting under the tree, Art finds a shilling in his pocket, rejoices and asks, 'Hey, Conn, if I give you a shilling can I have a cup of our whiskey?'
    'Aye, go on,' replies he, pocketing the shilling.
    A minute later Conn realizes he now has a shilling to spend, turns to his companion and asks, 'Art, what do you say? If I give you a shilling can I also have a cup?'
    'Aye, Conn,' Art agrees, taking back his shilling.
    And so they proceed, the shilling changing hands, until hours later Art and Conn are fast asleep under the oak tree with great grins on their faces, the barrel empty.
    Back to me. Basically, upon the insistence of the ECB, EUC and the IMF, who were demanding that before they received more public money, the greek banks had to raise some of their own. This they did 'a la Art and Conn', by founding offshore companies, secretly lending each other millions of euros without (secretly, of course) any collateral or guarantees. They then used the 'monies' from their offshore accounts to buy new shares in their own banks, thus fulfilling the regulators' requirement for new capital to be raised so they could qualify for the new capital. They, however, didn't have to face Orcan the publican's as they wrote off each others' loans, in effect owing nothing to anyone.
    This is almost a direct replica of the Savings and Loans scam in US during the 1980s.
    In this scam, however, the Greek banks also successfully enlisted the help of not only the ECB, but also the IMF and European Union's Commission!

...... and money creation is even simpler ...... you don't need the barrel of whiskey or the shilling! :wink:

Posted By: Kwacka

Yes 'fake news' about immigrants to EU, e.g. Merkel 'opening borders' to migrants (except she didn't) despite what RT & the DM says.
    Quote:
  • Peter Altmaier, Merkel's chief of staff, told Bild am Sonntag newspaper that nearly half of 700,000 asylum requests made in 2016 had been rejected, spelling another record high in deportations this year.
    To placate conservatives put off by Merkel's decision in 2015 to open German borders to refugees, leaders of her Christian Democrat party (CDU) have been pushing to deport more migrants whose applications have failed or foreigners who have committed crimes.

http://fortune.com/2017/02/19/germany-deports-asylum-seekers/
BTW, the question I asked was "Britain's economy is not strong, what leads you to think that it is?", a claim was made, I asked for evidence to back that claim.

Posted By: mouse

  • ProVox wrote:
    • geof j wrote:
      havent read all the comments, but have seen the £ almost 1 for 1 even before any referendum on brexit,
      currencies are volatile and are exposed to speculators, which will always be amongst the midst of investors.
      at the mo the pound is 1.08/9, i have seen it less before a brexit vote, so can Brexit be to blame?
      Britains Economy is strong, is Europes? i cannot understand how strong the Euro continues to be against the face of adversity.
      immigration, allowed by Europe at unprecedented rates continues to grow, these people have to be paid for,they have to be housed,educated, and receive health care, but the EURO remains strong?it beggars belief how!
      the "Deutshmark"/ "French Franc "cannot keep supporting the EU economy, their will be a collapse caused by other EU countries withdrawing support.
      The EU Ponzi scheme cannot continue, its about time the EU looked at Economics and Economies, rather than they impose a system which is unworkable

    Careful Geof .... you are applying common sense and looking at the whole picture. I was about to make a similar observation!
    I am more convinced than ever that the fall in the value of the GBP is driven by political considerations, not economics! The EU cannot let Brexit be seen to work as they know their precious United States of Europe would then vaporise as other states under stress would follow the UK.
    Only my opinion, of course. :roll: :wink:

Surely a contradiction of terms.
Geoff and common sense.😋😂

Posted By: spanner

This article was in the hard copy of today's Cyprus Mail, but they haven't put it online, however I have found it on the Belfast Telegraph online site.
    Quote:
  • UK sees record tourist numbers after pound’s post-Brexit plunge
    The number of visitors from North America surged by 35%, the ONS said.
    The Brexit-induced collapse in sterling helped push tourist numbers to a record high in June, with overseas visitors splashing out a total of £2.2 billion.
    Figures from the Office for National Statistics (ONS) show that foreign visits to the UK rose 7% year on year in June to 3.5 million.
    This included a 35% surge in North American visitors – from 483,000 to 650,000.
    Howard Archer, chief economic adviser to the EY ITEM Club, said that Americans were “clearly buoyed by the particularly sharp drop of the pound against the dollar”.
    Sterling has recently extended losses suffered following the Brexit vote last year, with the British currency down 14% against the dollar at 1.29.
    Visitors from Europe rose 2% year on year, with the pound tipped to reach parity with the euro in the coming months.
    More http://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/news/uk/uk-sees-record-tourist-numbers-after-pounds-postbrexit-plunge-36045333.html

I am sure this article is totally incorrect in attributing this to Brexit!

Posted By: Mr Tibbs

  • Kwacka wrote:
    BTW, the question I asked was "Britain's economy is not strong, what leads you to think that it is?", a claim was made, I asked for evidence to back that claim.

Economic performance is a relative term of course. You could probably fill pages with a "discussion" :lol: on it.
I unashamedly cherry pick here (off to get me new disk)
http://www.bbc.com/news/uk-politics-eu-referendum-35855869
http://www.cbi.org.uk/news/manufacturers-report-strong-output-growth/
This matter should rightfully be viewed in the context of all the Project Fear nonsense. Which of course has now been moved from economic Armageddon-like warnings from the day after the vote to "Ahh - well of course nothing's happened. We haven't left yet."
The CBI that cried "Wolf!"

Posted By: Woodrow Why?at

Now struggling to stay above 1.09......oh joy!!

Posted By: milano

Just received my monthly OAP payment from UK - perhaps better described as my "dwindling rapidly OAP monthly payment", the monthly decline in the amount over the past months has been more than worrying and with no sign of any let-up for the foreseeable future. Changes have had to be made to my lifestyle, which I did not particularly want to make, especially when they have been forced on me by "outside" forces! But, I'm so glad that I haven't been brainwashed into believing this has nothing to do with BREXIT, that I will never believe. KIZI

Posted By: Woodrow Why?at

  • milano wrote:
    Just received my monthly OAP payment from UK - perhaps better described as my "dwindling rapidly OAP monthly payment", the monthly decline in the amount over the past months has been more than worrying and with no sign of any let-up for the foreseeable future. Changes have had to be made to my lifestyle, which I did not particularly want to make, especially when they have been forced on me by "outside" forces!
    But, I'm so glad that I haven't been brainwashed into believing this has nothing to do with BREXIT, that I will never believe.
    KIZI

Some might say that only a 'simpleton' would believe it has nothing to do with Brexit!! 8)

Posted By: Woodrow Why?at

I started this thread on the 11th July when I was dismayed to see that the Pound had dropped to below 1.12 to the Euro! In retrospect what a halcyon time that was, as today the rate has gone below 1.08! :shock: Obviously, nothing whatsoever to do with the Brexit vote :roll: and, as some wise (!!) members have observed, not something any of us should be concerned about! #-o

Posted By: geof j

Surely a contradiction of terms. Geoff and common sense. do not insult me mouse, sometimes,only sometimes, i think therefore i am :D

Posted By: Kwacka

  • geof j wrote:
    Surely a contradiction of terms.
    Geoff and common sense.
    do not insult me mouse, sometimes,only sometimes, i think therefore i am :D

:?:

Posted By: mouse

  • Kwacka wrote:
    • geof j wrote:
      Surely a contradiction of terms.
      Geoff and common sense.
      do not insult me mouse, sometimes,only sometimes, i think therefore i am :D

    :?:

A contradiction, I think. :wink:

Posted By: Woodrow Why?at

  • Woodrow Why?at wrote:
    I started this thread on the 11th July when I was dismayed to see that the Pound had dropped to below 1.12 to the Euro!
    In retrospect what a halcyon time that was, as today the rate has gone below 1.08! :shock:
    Obviously, nothing whatsoever to do with the Brexit vote :roll: and, as some wise (!!) members have observed, not something any of us should be concerned about! #-o

The Pound has reversed it's downward trend of recent times and has, at this present time, recovered to nearly 1.11..........so only just over another 30 cents to go before it reaches it's pre Referendum peak! \:D/ :roll:

Posted By: Mr Tibbs

  • Woodrow Why?at wrote:
    The Pound has reversed it's downward trend of recent times and has, at this present time, recovered to nearly 1.11..........so only just over another 30 cents to go before it reaches it's pre Referendum peak! \:D/ :roll:

I doubt it will. Even if Brexit's reversed - and don't give up hope - "those who know best" are still trying hard. There's the irony though, the more successful they appear the greater the dampening effect upon Sterling.
The pre-referendum level was principally because "those who know best" were betting on a Remain vote. Betting being the operative word I think.
When the pound increases it will most likely be as a result of the Euro going down. That's on the cards.
Note. The Euro has recently surged to a multi-year high against the US Dollar, too.

Posted By: DAC

£1 - €1.11 on Caxton today

Posted By: Santorini Paul 1

Just whooshed up a cent to clear 1.12 after BOE hints at rate rise. http://www.bbc.com/news/business-41266528 Paul.

Posted By: DAC

  • Santorini Paul 1 wrote:
    Just whooshed up a cent to clear 1.12 after BOE hints at rate rise.
    http://www.bbc.com/news/business-41266528
    Paul.

€1.13 so far today

Posted By: Blondie

good its going up but it was it was at 1.42 a full 7 months before the vote , leading up to the vote it was average of about 1.28 so as of today it needs to climb about 15 cent to get to pre vote levels

Posted By: Kwacka

  • DAC wrote:
    • Santorini Paul 1 wrote:
      Just whooshed up a cent to clear 1.12 after BOE hints at rate rise.
      http://www.bbc.com/news/business-41266528
      Paul.

    €1.13 so far today

we're off out tonight to celebrate! :(

Posted By: mouse

  • DAC wrote:
    • Santorini Paul 1 wrote:
      Just whooshed up a cent to clear 1.12 after BOE hints at rate rise.
      http://www.bbc.com/news/business-41266528
      Paul.

    €1.13 so far today

You mean it is just about up to the value at the start of the thread, which was the point of the exercise.
So it has not improved since the opening post has it. :roll:

Posted By: Santorini Paul 1

Glass half full and all that :) Paul.

Posted By: Kwacka

Glass contains approximately 50% (by volume) of a liquid is the realistic way of expressing it - no 'spin'.

Posted By: Pete The Highwayman

Afternoon At close of play yesterday the pound to the euro Was trading at 1.1244 Pete

Posted By: DAC

  • Kwacka wrote:
    • DAC wrote:
      • Santorini Paul 1 wrote:
        Just whooshed up a cent to clear 1.12 after BOE hints at rate rise.
        http://www.bbc.com/news/business-41266528
        Paul.

      €1.13 so far today

    we're off out tonight to celebrate! :(

So you moan when the rate drops and you moan when it climbs. Typical response from an "owed everything" left-winger.

Posted By: Kwacka

  • DAC wrote:
    • Kwacka wrote:
      • DAC wrote:
        • Santorini Paul 1 wrote:
          Just whooshed up a cent to clear 1.12 after BOE hints at rate rise.
          http://www.bbc.com/news/business-41266528
          Paul.

        €1.13 so far today

      we're off out tonight to celebrate! :(

    So you moan when the rate drops and you moan when it climbs. Typical response from an "owed everything" left-winger.

What an idiotic comment from a self-confessed 'liberal' sic. :lol:
I complained that it had gone down and continue to do so, rather than getting down on my knees and tugging my forelock to my betters to thank the BoE for saying "we might put up the interest rate in the future" to the unbridled joy of those that make a very good living from buying and selling money.
So I'll be happy on April Fool's Day, 2019, when the pound soars due to the magnificent success of the UK leaving the EU on March 29th. :roll:
BTW, have I ever said anything that would cause you to suggest that I believe I'm 'owed everything'?

Posted By: mouse

  • Pete The Highwayman wrote:
    Afternoon
    At close of play yesterday the pound to the euro
    Was trading at 1.1244
    Pete

Same rate as the first post Pete which highlighted the demise of the pound.
So it has not risen has it. It just got back to the miserable amount as indicated in the first post.

Posted By: bubblechris

I thought it was over 1.13 and much stronger against the $? Where's, he who thinks he deserves an extra w for services to the remoaners, to update us?

Posted By: mouse

  • bubblechris wrote:
    I thought it was over 1.13 and much stronger against the $?
    Where's, he who thinks he deserves an extra w for services to the removers, to update us?

You don't mean a whole half a cent do you. :roll:
I am sure woody will be overwhelmed with emotion when he get's back. :lol:
I am sure he might tell you what you could do with that half a cent. :wink:

Posted By: Woodrow Why?at

  • bubblechris wrote:
    I thought it was over 1.13 and much stronger against the $?
    Where's, he who thinks he deserves an extra w for services to the remoaners, to update us?

Just when you thought the hokey cokey man couldn't get any more confused or irrational he always has the ability to trump himself!! :lol: What on Earth is he on about with regard to my thinking I deserve an extra 'w'....etc?!! :?
And as Chris is normally so interested in the Turkish Lira exchange rate I'm sure he'll be happy - or not - to hear that it is currently trading at 4.685 to the £. :D
BTW, sorry I couldn't reply sooner but have only just returned from a very enjoyable, and internet free, weekend away! :)
(Won't say where......wouldn't want to upset anybody! 8) )

Posted By: Mr Tibbs

Woody. Welcome back but............................ be happy. You've gotten richer by 1.45% since you left. What a misery guts you are. :lol: :wink: BTW. I hope you haven't picked up malaria on your trip to the unknown. :shock:

Posted By: Woodrow Why?at

Pound has just zoomed above 1.14 \:D/ ........Crikey, if this surge continues, I'll soon be able to afford another cup of tea!! :wink: :roll:

Posted By: Mr Tibbs

  • Woodrow Why?at wrote:
    Pound has just zoomed above 1.14 \:D/ ........Crikey, if this surge continues, I'll soon be able to afford another cup of tea!! :wink: :roll:

AFAIU, it's picked up because of what's happened to Merkel. She's got a few problems to sort out. Not the least of which is it could take as long as Christmas to negotiate the make up of Germany's next government. There appear to be a few potential conflict of interest factors.
The ole Forex "sentiment".

Posted By: mouse

  • Woodrow Why?at wrote:
    Pound has just zoomed above 1.14 \:D/ ........Crikey, if this surge continues, I'll soon be able to afford another cup of tea!! :wink: :roll:

You and Tea, now I know you are joking. :wink:

Posted By: Woodrow Why?at

Following Mrs May's disastrous performance at the Tory conference I see the Pound has, once more, dived below the 1.12 mark! :evil: Well done Theresa!! :twisted:

Posted By: 2diffs

  • Woodrow Why?at wrote:
    Following Mrs May's disastrous performance at the Tory conference I see the Pound has, once more, dived below the 1.12 mark! :evil:
    Well done Theresa!! :twisted:

I suppose it was her fault that the Fridge Magnets fell off, so she is probably responsible for mine falling off too.
Some comedian with a "P45" was also her doing, get a grip moaner alone?r.
More to do with another Brutus and his mate Cassius Longinus.

Posted By: Woodrow Why?at

  • 2diffs wrote:
    • Woodrow Why?at wrote:
      Following Mrs May's disastrous performance at the Tory conference I see the Pound has, once more, dived below the 1.12 mark! :evil:
      Well done Theresa!! :twisted:

    I suppose it was her fault that the Fridge Magnets fell off, so she is probably responsible for mine falling off too.
    Some comedian with a "P45" was also her doing, get a grip moaner alone?r.
    More to do with another Brutus and his mate Cassius Longinus.

Regardless of the reason, the performance was dire enough to start even more speculation about her future among the Tory brethren not to mention (as if!) the adverse affect on Sterling! 8)
P.S. Sorry to hear about YOUR magnets!! :lol:

Posted By: Woodrow Why?at

Whilst the Pound to the Euro continues to yo-yo above and below the 1.12 level, the good news is (and I'm sure that bubblechris will, especially, be delighted to hear this :lol: ) the Turkish Lira is fast approaching five (that's FIVE) to the Pound! \:D/ Now, if we could only convince the whole Island to convert to Turkish Lira!! :D

Posted By: bubblechris

  • Woodrow Why?at wrote:
    Whilst the Pound to the Euro continues to yo-yo above and below the 1.12 level, the good news is (and I'm sure that bubblechris will, especially, be delighted to hear this :lol: ) the Turkish Lira is fast approaching five (that's FIVE) to the Pound! \:D/
    Now, if we could only convince the whole Island to convert to Turkish Lira!! :D

How about we wait till it goes back to 5000 to the bound and then we can stick it in the rubbish along with your Turkish passport :wave:

Posted By: Woodrow Why?at

  • bubblechris wrote:
    • Woodrow Why?at wrote:
      Whilst the Pound to the Euro continues to yo-yo above and below the 1.12 level, the good news is (and I'm sure that bubblechris will, especially, be delighted to hear this :lol: ) the Turkish Lira is fast approaching five (that's FIVE) to the Pound! \:D/
      Now, if we could only convince the whole Island to convert to Turkish Lira!! :D

    How about we wait till it goes back to 5000 to the bound and then we can stick it in the rubbish along with your Turkish passport :wave:

Well, of course, if it did ever get to 5000 to the 'bound'( :lol: ) that would be EVEN better, as we would then get a thousand times the amount!! :D
As it is, I don't believe I have a "Turkish passport" :? but perhaps (there's always a first time!!)) you know better!! :shock: :lol: :lol:

Posted By: Woodrow Why?at

Turkish Lira just hit FIVE to the Pound! \:D/ \:D/ Five thousand here we come! :lol:

Posted By: mouse

  • Woodrow Why?at wrote:
    Turkish Lira just hit FIVE to the Pound! \:D/ \:D/
    Five thousand here we come! :lol:

Now, now Woody.
Stop stirring.

Posted By: Woodrow Why?at

  • mouse wrote:
    • Woodrow Why?at wrote:
      Turkish Lira just hit FIVE to the Pound! \:D/ \:D/
      Five thousand here we come! :lol:

    Now, now Woody.
    Stop stirring.

Not 'stirring' at all :? , Chris has always insisted on being updated on the progress of the Turkish currency! 8)

Posted By: bubblechris

One wonders if WW realises that the T/ lira is already a Mickey Mouse currency and the higher it goes the more MM it becomes? Could I be wrong :oops:

Posted By: mouse

  • bubblechris wrote:
    One wonders if WW realises that the T/ lira is already a Mickey Mouse currency and the higher it goes the more MM it becomes?
    Could I be wrong :oops:

Right and wrong, it is good for tourists, but no good for locals.
Inflation would increase.
And what have I got to do with it. :wink:

Posted By: Woodrow Why?at

  • bubblechris wrote:
    One wonders if WW realises that the T/ lira is already a Mickey Mouse currency and the higher it goes the more MM it becomes?
    Could I be wrong :oops:

Yea, a "Mickey Mouse" currency used by some 82 million people! :roll: :lol:
Now remind me how many 'millions' once used the Cyprus Pound!! :lol: :lol:

Posted By: Steve - SJD

Can we get back to the topic please?? Cheers Steve

Posted By: Santorini Paul 1

Pound now at 1.1421 mid-rate. Paul. :)

Posted By: Mr Tibbs

  • Santorini Paul 1 wrote:
    Pound now at 1.1421 mid-rate.
    Paul. :)

There's a lot of speculation about interest rates going up in the next week.
That'll please all those big mortgage holders that have been paying bottom dollar for years I guess. Swings and roundabouts.

Posted By: Woodrow Why?at

  • Santorini Paul 1 wrote:
    Pound now at 1.1421 mid-rate.
    Paul. :)

That's brilliant! \:D/ .......Only another 30 cents to go, till we reach the top level we had before they allowed the dense population of the UK.........oh you know the rest!! 8)

Posted By: Mr Tibbs

  • Woodrow Why?at wrote:
    • Santorini Paul 1 wrote:
      Pound now at 1.1421 mid-rate.
      Paul. :)

    That's brilliant! \:D/ .......Only another 30 cents to go, till we reach the top level we had before they allowed the dense population of the UK.........oh you know the rest!! 8)

Spot on. People should never be allowed to vote on such issues. They ought to be left to those who know best about these things.

Posted By: bubblechris

  • Mr Tibbs wrote:
    • Woodrow Why?at wrote:
      • Santorini Paul 1 wrote:
        Pound now at 1.1421 mid-rate.
        Paul. :)

      That's brilliant! \:D/ .......Only another 30 cents to go, till we reach the top level we had before they allowed the dense population of the UK.........oh you know the rest!! 8)

    Spot on. People should never be allowed to vote on such issues. They ought to be left to those who know best about these things.

are you talking about the Bankers that caused the great crashes of 2008? The politicians that took us into a federal union, the EU leaders that opened the doors to Eastern Europe and allowed the migrants to cross Turkey and the Med in their millions? The elite who allowed themselves to get richer and richer while millions were allowed to get poorer and poorer? Or are you just talking about Witless Woody?

Posted By: mac69

That 1.14 didn't last long , back at 1.12 now . Could it be the BOE announcement of the interest rate raise ?

Posted By: Woodrow Why?at

  • bubblechris wrote:
    • Mr Tibbs wrote:
      • Woodrow Why?at wrote:
        • Santorini Paul 1 wrote:
          Pound now at 1.1421 mid-rate.
          Paul. :)

        That's brilliant! \:D/ .......Only another 30 cents to go, till we reach the top level we had before they allowed the dense population of the UK.........oh you know the rest!! 8)

      Spot on. People should never be allowed to vote on such issues. They ought to be left to those who know best about these things.

    are you talking about the Bankers that caused the great crashes of 2008? The politicians that took us into a federal union, the EU leaders that opened the doors to Eastern Europe and allowed the migrants to cross Turkey and the Med in their millions? The elite who allowed themselves to get richer and richer while millions were allowed to get poorer and poorer? Or are you just talking about Witless Woody?

The point is, bc, which you fail with monotonous regulatory to grasp, is that the elected politicians are answerable to their electorate, and are held to account when the decisions they make turn out to be the wrong decisions!
Whereas the great uneducated are answerable to NOBODY!!
Sorry if that fact, in that mixed up, hokey cokey mind of your's, makes me "Witless"!! :roll:

Posted By: Mr Tibbs

  • bubblechris wrote:
    are you talking about the Bankers that caused the great crashes of 2008? The politicians that took us into a federal union, the EU leaders that opened the doors to Eastern Europe and allowed the migrants to cross Turkey and the Med in their millions? The elite who allowed themselves to get richer and richer while millions were allowed to get poorer and poorer? Or are you just talking about Witless Woody?

I give up. :(

Posted By: Kwacka

  • bubblechris wrote:

    are you talking about the Bankers that caused the great crashes of 2008? The politicians that took us into a federal union, the EU leaders that opened the doors to Eastern Europe and allowed the migrants to cross Turkey and the Med in their millions? The elite who allowed themselves to get richer and richer while millions were allowed to get poorer and poorer? Or are you just talking about Witless Woody?

What 'federal union'?
Who 'opened their doors' to migrants?

Posted By: Woodrow Why?at

Pound just gone below 1.10 (Bank rate) to the Euro! :cry: 'Brexit' still delivering, then!! :roll: P.S. Good news is T/L back over 8........so makes sense to 'spend' more time over 'there'! 8)

Posted By: mouse

  • Woodrow Why?at wrote:
    Pound just gone below 1.10 (Bank rate) to the Euro! :cry:
    'Brexit' still delivering, then!! :roll:
    P.S. Good news is T/L back over 8........so makes sense to 'spend' more time over 'there'! 8)

Stop stirring Woody.
It was however 1.09 in Nicks when we drove past earlier.

Posted By: sugarray1955

Transferwise current rate :cry: :cry: :cry:


Posted By: mouse

  • sugarray1955 wrote:
    Transferwise current rate :cry: :cry: :cry:

No! no! It's fake news. :wink:

Posted By: Woodrow Why?at

  • sugarray1955 wrote:
    • Woodrow Why?at wrote:
      • 2diffs wrote:
        On the horses you can't change your bet if the nag is loosing pace. With Forex you can close and re open several times a minute according to buy or sell is winning. In currency you can win even if the pound is dropping.

      Now this sounds promising \:D/ , so please advise how one can "close and re open (sic) several times a minute" at precisely the correct time to GUARANTEE a profit? :?

    The short answer is no you can`t, otherwise everyone would be sat around their PC doing it. Ask Barings Bank why this is not as easy to do as it is being implied :D
    Also it looks like someone has never used Betfair, where you can in fact play "in running" to minimise losses/maximise profits again no easy feat. I would love to see the portfolios of these "experts" who reckon it is so easy to make money on the financial markets. The difficulty in getting it right is the reason that approx 96% of "traders" lose money on Forex..

Oh ray, you have just ruined all my hopes of extreme wealth! :cry:
Now I expect you'll tell me there's no such person as Father Christmas! :wink: :lol: :lol:

Posted By: Woodrow Why?at

Pound today once more dropped below 1.12! :cry: How appropriate that in this season of goodwill the gift that is Brexit just keeps on giving! :roll: One can but hope that the Marquess's pensions are still going well!😂 (Although, for some reason, we haven't heard very much from him lately! :-k ).

Posted By: sugarray1955

  • Woodrow Why?at wrote:
    Pound today once more dropped below 1.12! :cry:
    How appropriate that in this season of goodwill the gift that is Brexit just keeps on giving! :roll:
    One can but hope that the Marquess's pensions are still going well!😂
    (Although, for some reason, we haven't heard very much from him lately! :-k ).

Aaaah but you shouldn`t have all your eggs in one basket :wink: a certain person will be salivating at the mouth with this latest drop in the exchange rate :lol: :lol: :lol:

Posted By: DAC

Glad I loaded up at €1.1251 as that should see us through for next years holidays.

Posted By: Kwacka

I just wish I'd 'loaded up' when it was 1.44 - then I could join you in your pleasure at the Shrinking pound. Never mind, Rees-Mogg reckoned we should see a benefit in 50 years, so out great-grandchildren should be OK.. :roll:

Posted By: DAC

  • Kwacka wrote:
    I just wish I'd 'loaded up' when it was 1.44 - then I could join you in your pleasure at the Shrinking pound.
    Never mind, Rees-Mogg reckoned we should see a benefit in 50 years, so out great-grandchildren should be OK.. :roll:

From what I've read the markets are as much worried about Corbyn becoming PM as they are about Brexit.

Posted By: Kwacka

  • DAC wrote:
    • Kwacka wrote:
      I just wish I'd 'loaded up' when it was 1.44 - then I could join you in your pleasure at the Shrinking pound.
      Never mind, Rees-Mogg reckoned we should see a benefit in 50 years, so out great-grandchildren should be OK.. :roll:

    From what I've read the markets are as much worried about Corbyn becoming PM as they are about Brexit.

And you believe everything you read?

Posted By: sugarray1955

  • DAC wrote:
    Glad I loaded up at €1.1251 as that should see us through for next years holidays.

Just off out now with my begging bowl :D if you see me in Lidl car park please spare a coin or two for me :wink: (As I need some extra spends for my Caribbean cruise in 3 weeks time, as I spent too much on my cruise around China/Japan in November ) :D Yes that is how much the drop in the exchange rate has affected my lifestyle :D :D :D

Posted By: sugarray1955

  • Kwacka wrote:
    • DAC wrote:
      • Kwacka wrote:
        I just wish I'd 'loaded up' when it was 1.44 - then I could join you in your pleasure at the Shrinking pound.
        Never mind, Rees-Mogg reckoned we should see a benefit in 50 years, so out great-grandchildren should be OK.. :roll:

      From what I've read the markets are as much worried about Corbyn becoming PM as they are about Brexit.

    And you believe everything you read?

This is the man who can see the future :D :D :D

Posted By: DAC

  • Kwacka wrote:
    • DAC wrote:
      • Kwacka wrote:
        I just wish I'd 'loaded up' when it was 1.44 - then I could join you in your pleasure at the Shrinking pound.
        Never mind, Rees-Mogg reckoned we should see a benefit in 50 years, so out great-grandchildren should be OK.. :roll:

      From what I've read the markets are as much worried about Corbyn becoming PM as they are about Brexit.

    And you believe everything you read?

Aren't you the same person that believes that Comrade Corbyn and his financial Marxist guru McDonnell are the next saviours of the modern working persons world?
https://www.ft.com/content/95f6e86c-a5fc-11e8-8ecf-a7ae1beff35b

Posted By: Kwacka

  • DAC wrote:
    • Kwacka wrote:
      • DAC wrote:
        • Kwacka wrote:
          I just wish I'd 'loaded up' when it was 1.44 - then I could join you in your pleasure at the Shrinking pound.
          Never mind, Rees-Mogg reckoned we should see a benefit in 50 years, so out great-grandchildren should be OK.. :roll:

        From what I've read the markets are as much worried about Corbyn becoming PM as they are about Brexit.

      And you believe everything you read?

    Aren't you the same person that believes that Comrade Corbyn and his financial Marxist guru McDonnell are the next saviours of the modern working persons world?
    https://www.ft.com/content/95f6e86c-a5fc-11e8-8ecf-a7ae1beff35b

I don't know how you've managed to extrapolate that from anything I've ever written or said that.
BTW, can you give us the benefit of your PH.D. in The socio/political/historical aspects of Marx and let us know what are your views of the postmodern interpretations of Marxism and ''post-Marxism' in Derrida's confrontation with Fukuyama's 'end of history' doctrine?

Posted By: Kwacka

Pound now down 1.10. And the UK hasn't left yet! :shock:

Posted By: journo

A local no-commission exchange, which usually offers exceptionally good rates, is now advertising 85 euro cents for every pound.......he's obviously worried he could even end up with at least a short-term loss.

Posted By: 2diffs

With a little knowledge, a close attention to political developments as Woody claims, he could have made up his pension shortage by investing in Forex during the discussions at Westminster. The EURGPB and GBPUSD were bouncing during this time as the news changed, it doesn't take much to realise a profit by buying and shorting over a short period watching the trade graphs, instead of the TV antics of the politicians.

Posted By: Woodrow Why?at

  • 2diffs wrote:
    With a little knowledge, a close attention to political developments as Woody claims, he could have made up his pension shortage by investing in Forex during the discussions at Westminster. The EURGPB and GBPUSD were bouncing during this time as the news changed, it doesn't take much to realise a profit by buying and shorting over a short period watching the trade graphs, instead of the TV antics of the politicians.

And, with a little knowledge of Horse Racing, I could have possibly picked the first five winners at Cheltenham, but..........!! :?
Incidentally, I really am humbled at your continued interest and concern for my pension! 8)

Posted By: 2diffs

On the horses you can't change your bet if the nag is loosing pace. With Forex you can close and re open several times a minute according to buy or sell is winning. In currency you can win even if the pound is dropping.

Posted By: Woodrow Why?at

  • 2diffs wrote:
    On the horses you can't change your bet if the nag is loosing pace. With Forex you can close and re open several times a minute according to buy or sell is winning. In currency you can win even if the pound is dropping.

Now this sounds promising \:D/ , so please advise how one can "close and re open (sic) several times a minute" at precisely the correct time to GUARANTEE a profit? :?

Posted By: sugarray1955

  • Woodrow Why?at wrote:
    • 2diffs wrote:
      On the horses you can't change your bet if the nag is loosing pace. With Forex you can close and re open several times a minute according to buy or sell is winning. In currency you can win even if the pound is dropping.

    Now this sounds promising \:D/ , so please advise how one can "close and re open (sic) several times a minute" at precisely the correct time to GUARANTEE a profit? :?

The short answer is no you can`t, otherwise everyone would be sat around their PC doing it. Ask Barings Bank why this is not as easy to do as it is being implied :D
Also it looks like someone has never used Betfair, where you can in fact play "in running" to minimise losses/maximise profits again no easy feat. I would love to see the portfolios of these "experts" who reckon it is so easy to make money on the financial markets. The difficulty in getting it right is the reason that approx 96% of "traders" lose money on Forex..

Posted By: 2diffs

This is a simplified explanation, it is like learning calculus, nothing is simple until the penny drops.
The basics rule is to select a situation which will cause a currency to rise or fall by studying the news.
Choose a figure to invest on a platform, set it up at the rate you decide to enter and decide on what margin of your investment you are prepared to loose if you get it wrong. This is called a stop loss.
When the currency move exceeds your limit the stop loss is automatically triggered by the platform. Ignore this option at your peril.
Watch the fluctuation and make a buy or sell move according to your analysis of the movement.
Trading real time also enables you to close or open on the press of a button.
If your profit shoots up, close and crystallise the gain; then follow with another buy order if you think the trend will continue.
You should aim at making a modest profit, don't expect it to go on, it may head in the opposite direction and loose all your gain in seconds.
If you expect a follow on crash make a sell order and execute it when the drop starts. On a good trade you can make $200 on the way up and another $200 as it goes back to where it was, all inside 10 minutes.
Trading on a relatively stable currency pair is difficult and less predictable. On an unstable pair such as EUGBP, if Theresa says something that is predicted to hurts the pound, it will happen in seconds.
You can even place two positions one up one down start them together and chop the loss maker manually or with a stop loss.
Trading is a skill, a little like chess, only use reliable information and a carefully considered strategy. Dedicate a limited time to get in and out and do not get distracted. Never trade more than 2 pairs at a time it needs split second timing and you need to be a genius at multi tasking to get beyond this level. Never leave a currency pair without a stop loss if you are taking a break, most losses are created because you expect the graph to pop back up from a losing position and you try to ride it out.
So if you know the time of a press statement, fire up the computer and pour a cup of coffee.
PS for example I took a break from writing to look at EUGBP exchange rate, it was peaking, so I took two consecutive minor sell positions and made $28 in less than 2 minutes, could have made $45 if I was on the ball and kept the sell open a little longer.


Posted By: Woodrow Why?at

:shock: Where's ProVox when you need him?!! :lol: :lol:

Posted By: Mr Tibbs

  • Woodrow Why?at wrote:
    :shock: Where's ProVox when you need him?!! :lol: :lol:

I suspect he'd be of little comfort to you on this particular subject. Although, I believe he's still an avid follower of the posts in here.
Interesting - that the pound " plummeted" this morning, on news of the confidence vote but then "spiked" when May said she will fight them on the beaches.
Nothing seems to ever happen in the world of Forex without a superlative attached.

Posted By: sugarray1955

  • 2diffs wrote:
    This is a simplified explanation, it is like learning calculus, nothing is simple until the penny drops.
    The basics rule is to select a situation which will cause a currency to rise or fall by studying the news.
    Choose a figure to invest on a platform, set it up at the rate you decide to enter and decide on what margin of your investment you are prepared to loose if you get it wrong. This is called a stop loss.
    When the currency move exceeds your limit the stop loss is automatically triggered by the platform. Ignore this option at your peril.
    Watch the fluctuation and make a buy or sell move according to your analysis of the movement.
    Trading real time also enables you to close or open on the press of a button.
    If your profit shoots up, close and crystallise the gain; then follow with another buy order if you think the trend will continue.
    You should aim at making a modest profit, don't expect it to go on, it may head in the opposite direction and loose all your gain in seconds.
    If you expect a follow on crash make a sell order and execute it when the drop starts. On a good trade you can make $200 on the way up and another $200 as it goes back to where it was, all inside 10 minutes.
    Trading on a relatively stable currency pair is difficult and less predictable. On an unstable pair such as EUGBP, if Theresa says something that is predicted to hurts the pound, it will happen in seconds.
    You can even place two positions one up one down start them together and chop the loss maker manually or with a stop loss.
    Trading is a skill, a little like chess, only use reliable information and a carefully considered strategy. Dedicate a limited time to get in and out and do not get distracted. Never trade more than 2 pairs at a time it needs split second timing and you need to be a genius at multi tasking to get beyond this level. Never leave a currency pair without a stop loss if you are taking a break, most losses are created because you expect the graph to pop back up from a losing position and you try to ride it out.
    So if you know the time of a press statement, fire up the computer and pour a cup of coffee.
    PS for example I took a break from writing to look at EUGBP exchange rate, it was peaking, so I took two consecutive minor sell positions and made $28 in less than 2 minutes, could have made $45 if I was on the ball and kept the sell open a little longer.

Wow, you must be one of the 4% who can actually make a sustained profit using Forex :roll: Give me Betfair any day...

Posted By: Woodrow Why?at

I see the Pound has had something of a resurgence in the past few days and is now hitting 1.15 to The Euro! \:D/ Couldn't have anything to do with the report that 'No Deal' is becoming increasingly unlikely, together with the possibility of a second referendum and consequently (whisper it!) no Brexiit at all.......could it?!! :D

Posted By: KIZI

Don't know how you could suggest such a thing Woodrow! :D KIZI


[ ADVERTS: UK Stores Delivering To Cyprus | Find eBay Misspellings - Grab A Bargain! ]



Viewing Cyprus Eastern Forum Archive - Lo-Fi Version | Visit Cyprus Eastern Forum - Full Version | Questions?

TOP TIP: BUYING PROPERTY IN CYPRUS? PLEASE ENSURE THAT YOU SEEK INDEPENDANT LEGAL ADVICE FIRST.
Cyprus forum covering Kapparis, Protaras, Pernera, Agia Napa, Agia Thekla, Paralimni, Larnaca, Oroklini, Pervolia & surrounding areas
Please note that the views expressed on this forum are those of the author and may not reflect the views of the management.